2x15 vs 1x15 + 4x10?

Stjofön Big · October 04, 2018, 02:55:06 AM

I've had my 2x15 cabinet, with one ElectroVoice, and one JBL, since -75. Never let me down! Sounds hungry and mean if I want to, and like smooth velvet when needed. But nowadays it's to heavy for me.

So my son, and I, changed speakers. I got his Ampeg Classic, made in Vietnam, 1x15 + Ampeg Classic 4x10. Connected it to my Fender Dual Showman.

Sounded thin!

So I'm thinking, maybe these 4x10 aren't made for me. Should I try to get another 1x15 Ampeg Classic, a 2x12, or something else? Suggestions are more than welcome!

Granny Gremlin · October 04, 2018, 07:41:56 AM

I find modern 4x10s have a very nasally sound that I don't like.

I say try the 1x15 on it's own to make sure it's giving you the baseline thump you need (some 1x15s can be very middish too or all bass with no mids or top - the EV and JBL combo would have been remarkably full range and balanced ) and if that's a good tonal base, try adding on a 1 or 2 x12.

I'm running a Musicman 115RH, formerly with an EV but now an RCF + a tall /diagonal style 4x12 with a pair of Faitals (highly recommend) + a pair of Weber Neomag 12s (best JBL clone I have found - all the tone/half the weight) which I may try swapping out for a pair of Cerwin Vega ER124s I scored recently. If those CWs work out I'm gonna sell the webers cause I have too many speakers laying about and they're worth too much money to just hold on to.

I wouldn't carry all that to a gig, not the size I play, usually just the 115RH, but it's awesome for jams and recording (flank the drums to get a bit of stereo spread).

gearHed289 · October 04, 2018, 08:02:53 AM

Quote from: Stjofön Big on October 04, 2018, 02:55:06 AMget another 1x15 Ampeg Classic

This! ^^^

Funny, I had an early 70s Ampeg 2x15 with an EV and a JBL for some time back in the 80s.

slinkp · October 04, 2018, 12:39:49 PM

I've played some nice (borrowed) rigs with stacked 1x15 cabs, definitely worth a try if you like the one you have.

If you're looking for variety and don't like the 4x10 (I have rarely found one I liked either) ... I'd echo the suggestion to see if there are any 2x12 cabs you can try out.
Or 2x10 for that matter - for reasons I don't understand, I've run into more 2x10s I can work with than 4x10s, which almost never make me happy.

Pilgrim · October 04, 2018, 02:00:19 PM

I find that 12" speakers have much of the character of 15s. I like the suggestion of trying a 2x12.

Dave W · October 04, 2018, 02:56:17 PM

When I was gigging, I sometimes brought a second 1x15 to stack.

doombass · October 05, 2018, 12:59:33 AM

Because of the total cone area of the 4x10" being larger than the 1x15" you probably heard more of the 4x10" than the 1x15". So I second the advice to try out each one solo. Not an ideal thing to do with your Dual Showman though because it demands a 4 Ohm load only. Maybe you can use a different amp to get an idea of the character of each cab?

amptech · October 05, 2018, 01:06:25 AM

Quote from: Pilgrim on October 04, 2018, 02:00:19 PM
I find that 12" speakers have much of the character of 15s. I like the suggestion of trying a 2x12.

+1

For bass it's just 12"s or 15"'s for me. My favourite stack has a 2x12" on top of a 1x15".

Stjofön Big · October 05, 2018, 02:32:33 AM

Thanks for all the input! Guess I'll start by checking the Dual Showman with just the 1x15. Come to think about it, I'm not sure what that sound will give, som I'm kinda excited by the idea. If satisfied, I'll check with the combination of 2x12, and another 1x15.
Thanks again!

Basvarken · October 05, 2018, 05:58:48 AM

Building a good cab is a matter of calculating the right dimensions and using the right materials.
When I first heard the Eden D210XLT cab I couldn't believe it was only a 2 x 10 inch cab. It projects very good and the (sub)lows are very good.
I think it is a very clever construction. Plus it's portable. I bought two of those and been a happy camper ever since.

Having said that, my Ampeg B40 (4 x10) cab is the opposite. Very poor efficiency. No tight lows. And way too heavy.

I don't think you can just change a 15" (part of a) cabinet by changing the front flange into a 4 x10 configuration. The depth of the cab should be changed too. And maybe even use of a bass port?

lowend1 · October 05, 2018, 07:58:53 AM

Two of my rigs include 15s. For the type of sporadic, small-venue gigs I do these days, I either take a pair of Ampeg B100R combos which are stacked and linked together and run as a pair, or a newer Acoustic 1x15 that I modded with an Eminence Gamma 15A and porting to match the speaker. If I need a little extra, I use an Ampeg SVT48HE (4x8" in a 2x10 box) that sits nice atop the 1x15 and gives me additional dispersion, plus a slightly different tone. The 4x8 has a surprising amount of bottom for that configuration, and can be used by itself as well, but is a little short, physically, to be heard well onstage if I'm standing. Nothing sounds as good to my ears as my old 810, but the practicality and logistics required of that are beyond questionable these days $:-\$ .
There is a fair amount of scolding over on TB regarding mixing speaker sizes - especially without a crossover, but as I recall, manufacturers were selling stacks configured that way back in the 90s. Bottom line - if it works for you, then it works.

gearHed289 · October 05, 2018, 08:57:01 AM

Quote from: lowend1 on October 05, 2018, 07:58:53 AMThere is a fair amount of scolding over on TB regarding mixing speaker sizes - especially without a crossover

TB silliness. My favorite cab is one I conceived and built myself. Basically an Ampeg 2x10 and a TL-606 built into one cabinet.

lowend1 · October 05, 2018, 11:16:46 AM

Quote from: gearHed289 on October 05, 2018, 08:57:01 AM
TB silliness. My favorite cab is one I conceived and built myself. Basically an Ampeg 2x10 and a TL-606 built into one cabinet.

No xover?
Looks pretty hefty.

Granny Gremlin · October 05, 2018, 04:37:22 PM

Crossovers aren't necessary and can cause more harm than good in MI applications. There's no need as all MI speakers are intended for full range use and to be 'crossed over' using their natural rolloffs. You're also not necessarily seeking a flat response (e.g. guitar speakers are specifically not flat in response; the ones that have been have not been well liked by guitarists).

I've used them to protect a mid-high fill cab with 2 vintage/low power 6" woofers and 2 tweeters in it from excessive bass that I knew they couldn't handle (used it with the MM 115RH as a small gig all in one bass amp and PA).

gearHed289 · October 08, 2018, 08:24:54 AM

Quote from: lowend1 on October 05, 2018, 11:16:46 AM
No xover?
Looks pretty hefty.

No, full range. I've never bi-amped a rig before, though I have used 2 amps at the same time (again, full range).

It's a very reasonably-sized cabinet. Pretty close to a Marshall 4x12. I recently swapped out my old EVM-15L (went to my combo amp) for a Eminence neo 15. It went from 110 lbs. to 96.