Trying hard to talk myself out of this...

[Denis]

That rust on the deck and hood are nothing to be concerned about.  If it's solid underneath and the price is right, I say go for it.  A '77 with a 440?  Weren't they into the 400 motors by then?

THe owner says the floor is sold and another photo I have shows a pretty nice looking firewall (another risky area on these cars).  I need to ask for better pics of the fender and quarter panel bottoms. He did paint them with a rustoleum black because of the rust which was there. I saw a photo of the car from 2011 before he got it running and it looked like there was a little rust but it wasn't bad.

Chrysler put the 440s into cars into the '78 model year but most went into police cars. They were, of course, down on power from the ultimate Mopar police car, the '69 Polara, which was tested by the Michigan State Police. That car made it to 60 in 6.3 seconds, hit the 1/4 mile at 99mph and hit 149 on the test track.

Still, the ex NCHP officer I once spoke to had one of these and he said he could easily get his to top 130mph, all 5500lbs of it and the junk in the trunk. Pretty impressive.

[Pilgrim]

Even though the doors and body generally got loose, they pulled hard and ran reliably.  Solid vehicles.

[nofi]

if those quarter mile times are legit they are in the area of late 60's muscle cars. 442, 396 chevelle ss, anything by mopar, gto etc...

[amptech]

If you buy it, you must of course only drive it wearing a black suit, white shirt and black tie, black stingy brim fedora, and sunglasses.

Or just dress up like big lebowski..

[Denis]

if those quarter mile times are legit they are in the area of late 60's muscle cars. 442, 396 chevelle ss, anything by mopar, gto etc...

They are and that is why the '69 Polara 440 police cars, especially the CHP cars, are worth so much money and so rare.

The '77 I posted about won't be as fast though, BUT because it's so old no emissions testing is required any longer so all that stuff could be ditched.

[lowend1]

First rule - never listen to Germans when it comes to Mopars. Remember what they did to Chrysler in that "merger of equals"...
'77 was the last year for the Plymouth/Dodge C-Body, so that's cool, but check to see if it's an original "U" code 440 - that's the good one. Everything inside was as heavy-duty as they come for that era. I think the fender tag should say "E86" for the motor. Unfortunately, it also came with the "Lean Burn" and dual cats, but that is of limited importance these days.
Unless I missed it, we haven't mentioned the asking price. Late 70s stuff has still not started to really escalate yet, so if you want to get in cheap, now is the time.
Bad gas mileage is a badge of honor - wear it proudly.

[Pilgrim]

They are and that is why the '69 Polara 440 police cars, especially the CHP cars, are worth so much money and so rare.

The '77 I posted about won't be as fast though, BUT because it's so old no emissions testing is required any longer so all that stuff could be ditched.

Also, if you're inclined towards engine mods, a 440 of that vintage is WIDE open for tweaks.  A carb and exhaust system with headers might be verrrrryyyy interesting.

[Denis]

It is a U code A38 but does not have the K code, which normal specifies "police". However, after reading up on this on a site dedicated towards '74-'77 C bodies, especially the Monacos and Royal Monacos, I've realized that there were wide latitudes applied to these cars. This one has carpet but the A38 normally comes with rubber mats.

Apparently, this car was more of an upscale Gran Fury to which the A38 police package was applied. That said, it could have been a special order, a replacement car, a detective's or captain's car, a government car but not a police car, an FBI car, etc.

Here's more information the guy sent me. He said $5000 would definitely get it but a good offer might.

1977 Plymouth Gran Fury  E86 A38 Police Package
This was an unmarked car
The vehicle was parked approximately 22 years ago
It was rescued in May of 2012
The Following new parts have been Installed:
-windshield
-fuel tank
-fuel pump
-Edelbrock carburetor
-tank sending unit
-water pump
-alternator
-radiator
brake master cylinder
-brake calipers
-all three rubber brake hoses
-dual fan belts
-radiator hoses
- A/C compressor [ still in box ]

All parts were installed in order to bring vehicle up to operating condition
It was necessary to replace the original engine, after sitting for so long it could not be turned over.
A replacement 440 engine from a 1974 Police Royal Monaco was installed.
The replacement engine received new gaskets but there are still some leaks, furthermore the wrong timing cover was used.
The original engine is included in the sale. It will be the buyers responsibility to make arrangements for transport of vehicle and engine. Help with engine loading is available.

The underbelly is very solid. The OEM exhaust is in place and intact and has a nice sound.
There is rust in the rear bottom of the front fenders and behind the rear wheels.
The rust that is visible on the upper body surfaces is due to age and paint failure, the area under the rust is solid.

I have driven this vehicle at speeds in excess of 75 mph, it handles well and rides well considering that it is 36 years old and un-restored

The passenger cabin is bone dry, no water leaks, floors are 100% solid

[Pilgrim]

The price for a big-block toy doesn't get much better than that.  But I doubt that I'd chase the fender rust - you can get into a lot of money fast.  Might be a 2 or 3 year car that you drive for fun, then resell.

If there's any leaking around the head gaskets, you should probably count on yanking the engine and replacing gaskets top to bottom while installing the correct timing chain cover.  Depends - if the leaks are around the pan gasket, you could just do that.  The timing chain cover isn't hard to change by itself.  If there's an intake manifold leak, you can do that by itself pretty easily.

[Denis]

Also, if you're inclined towards engine mods, a 440 of that vintage is WIDE open for tweaks.  A carb and exhaust system with headers might be verrrrryyyy interesting.

True enough! That no emissions checks are required (plus that the car is now an antique) means that it's pretty much wide open.

The price for a big-block toy doesn't get much better than that.  But I doubt that I'd chase the fender rust - you can get into a lot of money fast.  Might be a 2 or 3 year car that you drive for fun, then resell.

If there's any leaking around the head gaskets, you should probably count on yanking the engine and replacing gaskets top to bottom while installing the correct timing chain cover.  Depends - if the leaks are around the pan gasket, you could just do that.  The timing chain cover isn't hard to change by itself.  If there's an intake manifold leak, you can do that by itself pretty easily.

Yeah, any '60s-'70 440 equipped Mopar can go for big bucks these days, although large C bodies tend to be a little more rare as they get newer, thanks to demolition derby guys and people who strip out the 440s to put into slant 6 or 318 powered cars.

These big Gran Furys are rare and the Dodge Monacos (think Blues Brothers) are even more rare.

[lowend1]

As long as the original block hasn't been ventilated, you're good to go. I would buy it as cheaply as possible and set about on a rebuild of the (original) motor. As I said, the collector's market is still soft, but this is enough of a curiosity to make the project worthwhile. I think your hunch about this being something other than a garden variety cop car is on the money. I have seen Secret Service cars at shows that looked like nothing more than clapped-out C-bodies. You may want to invest in this book - I keep a copy on hand for reference myself. It's becoming a collectible in its own right.
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/0879389583?SubscriptionId=0QCHRJVSKG6F3BRGBNG2&tag=pbs_00005-20&linkCode=xm2&camp=2025&creative=165953&creativeASIN=0879389583

[nofi]

don't persuade yourself into buying this thing. i predict misery if you do. 5,000 indeed!

[rahock]

if those quarter mile times are legit they are in the area of late 60's muscle cars. 442, 396 chevelle ss, anything by mopar, gto etc...

Exactly, pretty good but not great. Top end is better than most GM and Ford stuff of the late 60s -early 70s but that's all about the rear end. Lot of Mopars of that era had good road gears and top end was up there. Mid 70s to early 80s were the worst built , worst running machines ever made in this country. I can't get too excited about anything from that era.
Rick

[nofi]

my 1968 roadrunner had a 3.23 rear end. it was standard equipment for that year. something lower might have been fun but it was hard enough keeping back tires on it already.

[lowend1]

The $5k price might sound a tad steep, and mid-late 70s quality issues are well-documented, BUT...
If you want to buy a running, driving car, and your budget is in that ballpark (or if you have an affinity for that era) - concessions will have to be made. Sure, you can buy a hammered GTX, Cuda or whatever from the 60s or early 70s, but you had better be prepared to spend another five figures getting it right. Under $10k these days gets you a project car - a REAL project. The other option is to go with a less popular platform, but anything that even remotely resembles a muscle car from that time period is commanding fairly good money, because of the "rise of the clones". The mid to late 70s stuff is still affordable, and most of the drivability issues (if present) can be ironed out pretty easily. In most cases, the rust issues are no more prevalent than a car from ten years earlier. There are actually some parts from the mid 70s that are sought after because they were made out of different materials. I had a guy offer to swap the aluminum-case 4-speed out of my '77 Volare Road Runner for the OE box from his '68 340 Dart. Why? Because the aluminum was lighter and better for drag racing - he didn't even care about the guts. Likewise, some later Darts and Dusters were built with aluminum body panels (hood, trunk, etc) to subtract weight - but for fuel economy purposes.