The Ric 4001 ...

[Chris P.]

Post the copy at 'other bass brands'!

[ilan]

You can post it here, as long as it doesn't have a real Ric TRC.

[doombass]

Though I have quite a deal of different Gibson basses my '74 Ric 4001 gets played also. It's an immediate design you react to. I also love the guitar looks. I was a guitarplayer when  the 381 John Kay model came out and I almost freaked out when I saw it. Here's my Ric:

[OldManC]

You can post it here, as long as it doesn't have a real Ric TRC.

Cool! I would never try to pass a copy off as the real thing. I like it for what is is, but it ISN'T a Ric. Someday I'll have one with the right TRC... And maybe even an upside down headstock!

[Chris P.]

Nice bass! What's on the TRC?

[ilan]

Nice

Nice bass! What's on the TRC?

"Grecoguitar"

"S" copies are pretty rare. How does this one sound? Close to a real Ric?

I'm asking because copies don't have padauk boards, and I have this theory that fretboard material has a major part in a guitar's overall sound. Sometimes more than the body wood.

[Bert]

I have this theory that fretboard material has a major part in a guitar's overall sound. Sometimes more than the body wood.

At the moment Chris's 4005 is staying at my place (dont tell Chris we are migrating to new zealand next week please). And I'm surprised at the similarities in sounds between my other Ricks (mainly 4001's) and the 4005.

[OldManC]

Nice
"Grecoguitar"

"S" copies are pretty rare. How does this one sound? Close to a real Ric?

I'm asking because copies don't have padauk boards, and I have this theory that fretboard material has a major part in a guitar's overall sound. Sometimes more than the body wood.

It sounds close, but not exact. Besides the board being different, there's also only one truss rod, which may make a difference as well. I have yet to outfit it with flats, which will be the deciding factor on whether it sounds 'close enough'. Once I do that I'll report on what I find.

[Barklessdog]

Sorry about not answering about my son's Ric's bass. I'm not sure what year it is?

It is a 4003 though.

He bought it off of E-bay in near mint condition for $850 about 7 years ago? Now, I bet it is worth $1200.

A lot of people don't understand about the true value of basses. Also that Rics are one of a kind basses. They have both great value as a players instrument and hold their value very well, unlike a lot of Fender clone basses.

[uwe]

I think that neck stability is more a matter of neck woods and construction, than it is the truss rods.

In difficult cases, John Hall suggested tightening the rods like you would tighten old-style folded rods, i.e., pull the headstock backwards with your hand and then use the rods to "lock" the neck into position.

Did you check the body-end part of the rods? Perhaps the acorn nuts are sinking into the wood?

I have many times in the past adjusted the rods slightly different, most of the times it was when the bass side had a slight curve and the treble side was straight.

Another advantage of the Ric truss rods, old and "new" (post '85), is that you can easily pull them out, fix what needs to be fixed, then insert them back inside the neck. This can be done on your kitchen table, no need for special tools. You can't do that with a Fender or a Gibson.



Here's another idea. When you pull the rods out you can see that they are curved. This was done in the factory. Don't attempt to straighten them. In some cases the rods "flip over" inside the channel and the curve is in the wrong direction. I did this with my Shadow: removed the rods, then inserted them back inside making sure the curve was in a back-bow. Until I did that, I had to use TI's because of the low tension. Now I use medium gauge DR's, the neck is dead straight - zero relief - and very stable.

Ilan, ever since I read this from you, I've been thinking whether this might be the so far elusive solution to the neck problems of my eight string. With all the bad experiences I've had with the neck tension of mine, I doubt it (remember: it already features the second pair of trussrods after the first one gave up), but hope dies last. So today - after the neck was badly concave again after the last set up a few months ago though all the bass did was rest in its stand in the same place, never do I have to loosen tension with this bass' trussrods irrespective of climate, it always demands "tighter, tighter!" until the truss rods break  - I dismantled everything like you did in your picture, but I'm stumped with loosening the acorn nuts that hold the rods at the high end of the neck (towards the neck pup). What kind of tool made in hell will be able to access those holes to get a grip on the acorn nuts? I see a rectangular nut wrench in your pic, what size is that, where did you get it from and does that actually fit into the holes yet get a grip on the acorns?

"No need for special tools" you said!   

[ilan]

Uwe: in the pic is a '73 4001 with the old style rods. There are no acorn nuts at the body end. Yours OTOH has the newer style rods. Elongated hex nuts at the headstock end, acorn nuts at the body end.

So here's what you do. Remove the adjustment hex nuts from the headstock end of the rods, and then push the rods inside the neck cavities, just enough for the acorn nuts to come out of the body end of the neck. Now it's easy to remove the acorn nuts if you want (but you don't need to, unless you want to pull the rods out of the bass). Next, push the rods back into the neck (from the body end) and pull them completely out through the headstock end, using pliers (protect the headstock with a soft cloth first).

You will see that the rods are curved. You want to insert them back inside with a backward bow, to counteract the string pull.



You don't have to pull the rods out of the neck completely or even remove the acorn nuts. Just push the rods inside the neck from the headstock end (I use a large screwdriver) about an inch, turn 180 degrees at the body end (you can mark the acorn nut with white correction fluid, a small dot on the top, turn inside the channel until the dot is at the bottom) and push back into place. Re-install the hex nuts at the headstock end and adjust.

[uwe]

Ah, I see, thanks a lot will try that when I've braced myself to do it. The way the neck on my 4003 is concave even with no string pull, it will take some brute force to get those truss rods out of the channels, they seem so snugly inside them.

When turning the acorn nuts without seeing the way the trussrod lies in the channel, how do I know that the trussrods are convex to the fretboard (countering string pull) and not concave?

[ilan]

The way the neck on my 4003 is concave even with no string pull, it will take some brute force to get those truss rods out of the channels, they seem so snugly inside them.

The neck is concave even without strings because the truss rods are bent this way. Instead of exerting force against the string pull, they work with the strings. Right now they have the same curve as the neck, so they will pull out easily through the headstock. You'll see.

When turning the acorn nuts without seeing the way the trussrod lies in the channel, how do I know that the trussrods are convex to the fretboard (countering string pull) and not concave?

You can feel it as you turn them. Make a few turns inside the channel, you will see what I mean. It will feel easier to turn when the curve is the same, but you want to stop turning when resistance is highest, i.e., when the rod is convex.

If it doesn't turn, pull the neck straight manually, and then turn the rods. I do it by having the bass stand on a carpet with its back in my direction, pulling the headstock back with my left hand while pushing the neck forward (gently) with my knee in the middle of it. Then I adjust the rods with my right hand.

[bobyoung]

I bought my first one in 1977 a new mapleglo 4001 w/case for 479.00 at Wurlitzer's in Boston. I could not get enough presence out of it, sold it a few years later and stayed with my Fender P basses and then bought a 1980 4001FL for 500 bucks in a music store in 1990, I then bought a white with black trim 81 4001, on and on. It took me a long time to realize that the cap was sucking all the life out of the 4001's and it was a Eureka moment when I finally tried the simple reversible mod. I tried it first on my 79 4001 mapleglo in 2003 which I still own and it was like, wow, my Ric is suddenly hear,  I could hear the low mids which the cap scoops out and which gives these basses their presence (any bass actually). I've had so many over the years that a conservative estimate is at least 25, both 4001's and 4003's. The necks got chunky around 1996 and stayed that way until relativity recently, they are supposed to be thinner since about last year.
They took out the cap in late 1984 and put it back in a few years ago with a switch to put it in and out of the circuit, I had one and still hate the cap.
With 4001's if the nuts are digging into the back of the TR cavity it is because the strings are too heavy. Always push the neck backwards to take the tension off the neck from the strings forward pull as you tighten the truss rods on a 4001, also the truss rods are very light metal, if all of a sudden the nut won't turn any more at a certain point and the neck is still bowed it is likely that the threaded part has twisted and distorted the thread pattern, be careful you can snap the thread right off the end of the rod.
I always use flatwounds on all my basses including Rics, usually chromes. I now only own two Rics: a 72 jetglo 4001FL and the 79 mapleglo 4001. I plan on buying a new 4003FL since I have heard that they have finally got the side dot situation correct.

[bobyoung]

I just had my '76 4001 looked at by a Ric expert in San Francisco - first time I had seen the rods pulled out of the neck like that. At one point, he had me hold the body down while he pushed down on the neck to straighten it!

Finally a luthier who knows how to adjust 4001's. You need to do this is some way or other with all 4001's, in fact I do this with all basses. I have since I bought my first good bass, a new 1971 Fender P bass when I was 18 which I paid 250.00 with case on layaway. The booklet that came with it suggested doing this when tightening the truss rod and I've always done it.