how to?

sniper · October 06, 2008, 01:26:44 PM

how can one age wood without an investment of years?

i have read that old wood sounds better. well is there a way to artificially age wood? can it be baked slowly?

drbassman · October 06, 2008, 01:34:06 PM

I always recommend building the guitar and playing the hell out of it. That usually ages it just right. The problem with artificially aging something like a natural product like wood is the result can be artificial too. Just my 2 cents.

shadowcastaz · October 06, 2008, 01:52:53 PM

Buy old wood !Simple,yes?

sniper · October 06, 2008, 02:05:43 PM

i have been offered free access to a BIG recently harvested (this last year) maple trunk that is estimated to be 100+ years old and am trying to figure out what to do with it other than have a bonfire party.

i think i'll try to find a local sawmill and ask questions.

Dave W · October 06, 2008, 02:47:41 PM

IMHO it's just a marketing myth with no evidence to back it up.

Even if there were something to it, aging wood artificially would be, errmm, artificial.

There is some evidence that the vibrations in true acoustic instruments change with age, but that may be because of the glue joints changing, not necessarily because the wood has changed.

Bass VI · October 07, 2008, 01:08:15 AM

Of course this is just an opinion, but I think it's moisture content not age that makes for good "tonewood". Wood by it's nature absorbs and releases moisture, and over the course of time probably reaches some state of equilibrium, the trick (again just an observation) is to dry the wood out so any moisture exchange is from the atmosphere and not from the water in the wood itself. There is a whole lot more to it than that, but I think if you can get the wood cut unto managable pieces and let it dry (naturally or "artificially" in a kiln) you might get something more musical than a crackling fire!

Scott

Pilgrim · October 07, 2008, 10:23:44 AM

One theory out there is that the vibrations of musical notes tend to influence the wood over time. Some folks I have read about like to take a new instrument (especially acoustic), stick it in front of a stereo speaker, turn on the stereo and let it play for a week. They feel that this improves the sound of the instrument, I guess by breaking in the wood to resonate.

rahock · October 07, 2008, 11:52:33 AM

Quote from: Dave W on October 06, 2008, 02:47:41 PM
IMHO it's just a marketing myth with no evidence to back it up.

Even if there were something to it, aging wood artificially would be, errmm, artificial.

There is some evidence that the vibrations in true acoustic instruments change with age, but that may be because of the glue joints changing, not necessarily because the wood has changed.

I'm no expert on this, but I have a pair of ears (one mounted strategicly on each side of my head) and it seems to me that thirty years seems to be when the magic happens. I know it is a gradual process and things like the vibrations an instrument is exposed to are factors, but the thirty year thing just keeps proving itself to me .

Wow, there's hope for me! As I approach my second 30 years, I hope to sound even better!

I've got an Earthwood acoustic bass that I bought in 1972 and it always sounded good, but when it hit the thirty year mark, the sound just took on a whole new richness. I've got a Guild acoustic guitar that did the same thing. I've got a few buddies with acoustic guitars that they have had for many years and it seems that the thirty year thing holds true for everyone I've talked to.

Rick

nofi · October 07, 2008, 12:32:04 PM

i gotta' put my olympia in the way back machine for a quick twenty years or so.

Dave W · October 07, 2008, 12:43:49 PM

Quote from: Pilgrim on October 07, 2008, 10:23:44 AM
One theory out there is that the vibrations of musical notes tend to influence the wood over time. Some folks I have read about like to take a new instrument (especially acoustic), stick it in front of a stereo speaker, turn on the stereo and let it play for a week. They feel that this improves the sound of the instrument, I guess by breaking in the wood to resonate.

Well, if they want to do that, it won't hurt anything, but it's absurd to think doing that would change a solidbody at all. And even with changes in acoustic instruments (as Rick mentioned with his Earthwood and Guild acoustics), no one has yet been able to show that the wood itself vibrates differently. Even if it does, it takes years.

rahock · October 07, 2008, 02:03:30 PM

Quote from: nofi on October 07, 2008, 12:32:04 PM
i gotta' put my olympia in the way back machine for a quick twenty years or so.

I've been told by a few "wood gurus" not to expect the same type of thirty year magic from a plywood piece like our Olympias. The laminate construction throws a few variables into the equation, and no one I know , believes they wil age as gracefully. I'll either be dead or farting dust in rocking chair at some old folks nut house so I'll never find out if their right or wrong

I've also got a mandolin that's about 140 years old and I'm having trouble finding anyone who can tell me how it sounded when it was new

So.... if the way back machine is a two seater...... can I come too

Rick

Pilgrim · October 13, 2008, 10:58:17 AM

There's also a body of belief that some changes in sound come from the process of wood aging and settling into a long-term state of stability and moisture content.

Me? I can't hear a difference. None. My 1963 P doesn't sound that different from my 2000 MIM jazz, except that one sounds like a P and one sounds like a J. I'm one of those philistines who think that strings and electronics are so determinant of the final sound that the wood used is moot.

drbassman · October 13, 2008, 11:05:15 AM

I'm going to go out on a limb here and suggest that acoustic instruments do change with age much more than solid slabs of wood and the differences can be audible. My 2 cents!

rahock · October 13, 2008, 11:50:24 AM

I'll agree with that 2 cents completely. On an Acoustic instrument the aging process is very much a factor. On an electric it's debatible at best. Personally, I would want to avoid that debate.
Just listen to how good a Dano sounds and then tell me it's all about the wood

Rick

Dave W · October 13, 2008, 11:52:07 AM

Quote from: Pilgrim on October 13, 2008, 10:58:17 AM
There's also a body of belief that some changes in sound come from the process of wood aging and settling into a long-term state of stability and moisture content.

The problem with that belief is that wood doesn't settle into long term stabilty and moisture content. No matter what finish you put on it, no matter how old it gets, there's always moisture exchange going on with its environment.

If you build a new piece of furniture and put it in the same house as a 200 year old antique, they'll both be at the same moisture content within a short time. When it gets cold this winterand the relative humidity drops, they'll both be at a lower moisture content. And so it goes.