The Last Bass Outpost
Gear Discussion Forums => Bill's Shop: Projects, Mods & Repairs => Topic started by: Pilgrim on February 10, 2009, 11:51:44 PM
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I picked up this little gem on Ebay for $85 including shipping. The seller said in the auction that he thought it was the wrong neck, but on asking, I learned that he just thought the neck should be painted to match the body. It certainly appears to me that the neck is correct and original. That's good evidence that the seller knows diddly about guitars and basses, as there is a neck problem that wasn't mentioned in the auction.
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&ssPageName=STRK:MEWNX:IT&item=380099502927
It's in good condition overall, but there is a hump in the neck (toward the strings) from the 5th through about the 12th fret. It's symmetrical, not a sharp hump. I'm going to loosen the truss rod and put the neck in a simple jig to press it back into straightness. The bridge is jacked WAY up to get the strings over the hump, and it's actually somewhat playable as is. I believe the problem can be fixed, and straightening the neck should allow me to bring the bridge back down to a normal height.
I'm a bit of a sucker for this body style, and for Lyle and other Matsumoku basses..and the bass isn't beaten up. If the neck comes out OK, it could be a pretty fun bass, and the price is right.
(http://i83.photobucket.com/albums/j306/apowell1/Electric%20Basses/Lyle%20SG-clone/Lylewide.jpg)
Any other suggestions? I'm traveling through Sunday, so I won't get a chance to post more pix till late that day.
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It reminds me a bit of Hagstrom basses. Nice.
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Yes, I can see the resemblance. The neck plate is upside down on it, so clearly the neck has been off and someone has played around with it...I'm convinced the neck is the right one. But given that whoever messed with it wasn't sharp enough to get the plate back on right-side-up, I'm not assuming they knew anything about necks. The only other obvious problems are that many of the PG screws are missing and some of the tuner mounting screws are missing, but that only requires a trip to the hardware store. The top hat Vol/Tone knobs are original and in good shape.
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$85 delivered and it's playable. And maybe you can fix the hump (http://www.geocities.com/Hollywood/Set/4159/hump1.wav). ;D
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(http://www.halkans.com/images3/772hagstrom.jpg)
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Dang! They do look similar....a bit longer upper horn on the Hagstrom, different switches on the top right PG area, and a different output jack.
And I'm curious about Dave's link, but it no workie right now - I get a Yahoo error page.
(http://i83.photobucket.com/albums/j306/apowell1/Electric%20Basses/Lyle%20SG-clone/Lylewide2.jpg)
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And I'm curious about Dave's link, but it no workie right now - I get a Yahoo error page.
Works for me. It's a sound clip you may remember from Young Frankenstein.
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If pressing the neck doesn't work, you could remove the frets around the hump and use a radius block to sand it down, or go nuts and level the entire fret board. Either way, you haven't invested too much already, so you have some room to work with. I like the look of these too.
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Works for me. It's a sound clip you may remember from Young Frankenstein.
Works now! Nice! I would like to reply with a clip from "As Good As It Gets" but I don't have time to set it up at the moment - maybe after I get back from a trip....be traveling next 4 days.
Nice thought on the neck, Dr. Bassman...hopefully that won't be required but it is good to keep in mind.
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Some good news! Last night I finally got time to pull the truss rod cover (yes, sometimes it's a week or two before I can get to this kind of thing...) and back the truss rod nut off all the way - and voila, the hump seems to have essentially disappeared!!
Now I need to get a ferrule for the D-string tuner that's missing one, and a set of strings, and I'll be ready to give it a test drive. I've been able to lower the bridge way, way down to a normal playing height and tighten up the two strings with working tuners (A & E) and the action appeared to be OK.
I'll keep my fingers crossed about what happens once I get the tension of all four strings on that neck. I probably backed the truss rod off about 1.5 full turns, so if needed, I might be able to snug it a bit without causing the hump to re-appear.
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1.5 turns? i thought conventional wisdom dictated 1/4 turn at a time with a day or so in between to settle. ???
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Normally yes, but my purpose was not to adjust it, but to remove all tension from the truss rod. No moderation in adjustment needed - just let the neck relax. So I just backed it off until the nut turned freely.
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You might try extra light gauge strings, or at least lighter than normal. That might solve the problem without any chiropractic adjustments.
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Excellent idea! When I get the pieces together I'll go for light gauge strings to reduce the neck loading. I'm actually hoping that it pulls the neck forward just a little - it's pretty straight in its unloaded condition. I'll measure the ferrules and get strings and ferrule(s) ordered this weekend, I hope. Should be a nice change of pace from tearing out the shower stall in one bathroom....
Checking at Juststrings....
My favorite Labella Deep Talkin' Extra Light short scales are .039-.096, cost $43
but Rotosound has the RS77S Jazz Electric Bass Monel Flatwound Short Scale, .040-.090, $35
and GHS has the #3020 Precision Flatwound 30-31" Scale, .045-.095, Precision Flatwound, $24
I have a set of Rotosounds on one of my basses....and GHS on another. I keep forgetting which, but I like both. I think I'm pretty easy when it comes to strings. but I could try something radical and put rounds on it.
Naaaaah.
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TI Jazz flats are the lightest gauge going. They make a 32" scale set.
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I think about TIs occasionally, but my beer and pizza budget keeps getting in the way.
TIs at $54, GHS at $24.......decisions, decisions.......
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No way, I get them for less. Let me look up my supplier's URL and get back to you.
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Much 'bliged......
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Much 'bliged......
I get them here http://bassguitarstrings.us/store/home.php?cat=260
You can get a 10% discount if you are a member of the BABP forum as well. Been buying from Tom for a couple years and he's great.
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Don't do it, Al! Go for the LaBellas or the GHS! Resist the TIs! :)
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Thanks, Bill. That does reduce the difference a bit - I'll think on it.
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Hey....does anybody have a line on where to buy spare TUNER ferrules? I'm missing one on that Lyle bass, and so far I've spent more than a half-hour searching the web with no luck. I've only found two or three places that carry any ferrules for use on bass tuners, and they are all for Fenders...not the right size.
The ferrules on the headstock of this bass have an inside diameter of .397 inches (about 9.93 mm) where the tuner post goes through, and the shoulder that presses lightly into the headstock is .469 (11.9 mm) outside diameter. They seem to be larger than most ferrules. The ferrules are smooth on the outside shoulder, but I sure wouldn't turn down ones with serrations on the shoulders either.
Any ideas?? ???
Later note....after another half-hour searching, I found that Allparts.com has both "bushings" and tuners at an affordable price, including tuners similar to the ones on the Lyle...but they don't provide any dimensions. I emailed them for info. Other ideas still welcome!
This set looks pretty similar to the tuners on there, and is only $25.
http://www.allparts.com/store/tuning-keys-bass-tuning-keys-tk-7945-010,Product.asp (http://www.allparts.com/store/tuning-keys-bass-tuning-keys-tk-7945-010,Product.asp)
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They are going to be hard to find I'm sure. They sound too big for adapting guitar string ferrules.
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Could you possibly adapt a drill bushing? If you can't find a selection from a local industrial supply house, try an online place like McMaster-Carr or MSC Industrial Supply.
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I was thinking the same thing Dave.
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they are indeed too large for adapting guitar bushings - they seem to be on the large side even for bass tuners.
BUT - I'd never heard of drill bushings before. Cool idea!!
A little online searching inclines me to think that I may be able to make them work. If I can find some with the right length and outside diameter - and either the correct or a smaller inside diameter - a local machine shop should be able to machine out the centers to the correct I.D., although it appears that those bushings are often hardened steel.
I'll keep that option in mind and do some searching for the proper fit.
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Don't worry too much about the bushing length. A lot of ferrules only go part way into the headstock. The set on my Vox only go in about 1/4". They only need to cover the top of the tuner hole for the post to ride inside. That's all that's necessary to keep the post form binding against the headstock wood.
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I found two other possible sources - both have tuners at good prices if I can't find a bushing...
http://www.guitarpartsresource.com
http://store.guitarfetish.com/info.html
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Found the bushings! Allparts.com has them:
http://www.allparts.com/store/tuning-keys-bushings-buttons-tk-0799-001,Product.asp
The bushing ID is just .003 larger than the original, which isn't enough to matter. The OD is .028 larger than original, well within my ability to adjust with gentle filing or just a turn of a manual reamer. The bushings may even slide in, given that the bass is 30 years old.
$10 plus shipping looks good. Allparts doesn't list the dimensions but they were quick with an email response. I searched for hours online and this was the only place I could find bushings or tuners that matched the originals.
And if the tuners have problems, Allparts has look-alike replacements - and it's the only place I could find them!
http://www.allparts.com/store/tuning-keys-bass-tuning-keys-tk-7945-010,Product.asp
If anyone else is looking for replacements for a 2x2 tuner arrangement on an old Japanese bass, these might be good to know about.
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Cool! Congrats. Persistence pays off.
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It turned out to be a nice opportunity - I also ordered tuner mounting screws, pickguard screws and a couple of other odds and ends. Allparts charges $7 for domestic shipping. Might as well get the best bang for my buck. I also ordered new nut blanks and a string adjustment gauge from Stew-Mac. I will order strings for the Lyle tomorrow...getting late tonight.
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The parts are here! I guessed wrong on the tuner bushings, but I found that could rob them off my Kay KB-2 bass with the warped neck. I also grabbed the strings off it, since it's not a player at this point, and installed them on the Lyle.
After some meatball setup, I can tell that both pickups work, and I've managed to get it playing OK except for fret buzz on the third fret of the G string. But I'm going to leave it strung up for a couple of days to see what shape the neck takes. Between gluing the fertboard back on and whatever odd forces the truss rod may have generated, I think it deserves some time to settle in.
It sounds decent, but I still have a lot of cleanup to do before I know what it's capable of.