'66-69 NR T bird questions

[Denis]

So, now that I have an incoming NR II I have some questions about them. And yeah, I'm expecting (and hoping) Scott and Uwe to chime in on this one!

According to Jules site, the production breakdown is as follows:
1966= 361, 1967=0, 1968=67, 1969=7.

The current owner of mine says he couldn't locate the serial number. The bass has been painted an ugly red and he removed the paint on one portion to check for one.
IF there is no number for whatever reason, are there any other ways of identifying what year it is (I don't yet know what's on the pots)?
Did the body thickness vary between the years?
Where there any headstock differences?
Were the pups all located in the same place?

Any other information would be appreciated!
Thanks!

[godofthunder]

  Serial numbers are stamped on the headstock and nowhere else that I know of. Bodies are very  inconsistent in thickness and edge radius. My '68 that I have had forever has the thickest body and maybe a 1/4" radius on the edges, my '66s have a thinner body and a approximate 3/8" radius on the edge. Neck thickness can vary greatly. My '68 has a baseball bat of neck while both my '66s have a much slimmer profile. If there is no serial number stamped on the back it was sanded off and that would require removing a lot of material. The other possibility is that the headstock was replaced. I'll have to get my '69 out and make some comparisons.

[dadagoboi]

Usual way to date a 60s bass if no serial number is the 7 digit pot code.  The first 3 denote the manufacturer and the last four are year and week the pot was made.  e.g. 1376624 would be CTS, 1966, 24th week.

I have a pair of '64 Tbirds, one has a very chunky neck and the other very slim.  As Scott says, there is a lot of variation.

[EvilLordJuju]

According to Jules site, the production breakdown is as follows:
1966= 361, 1967=0, 1968=67, 1969=7.

Yes, but remember these are the shipping, not production figures - when guitars are selling well (eg the EB0 at this time) they pretty much shipped them as fast as they built them. When they were not selling well (eg NR tbirds) they may have sat around for months or even years. Do the 7 '69 Tbirds have '69 pots? I don't know for sure, and I actually suspect not...

[Denis]

Received more pics.

Rear pot.


Center pot (I think for the j pup installed at one time). Has numbers but I doubt it's original.


Forward pot. Has numbers, maybe original, maybe not.

[Denis]

Yes, but remember these are the shipping, not production figures - when guitars are selling well (eg the EB0 at this time) they pretty much shipped them as fast as they built them. When they were not selling well (eg NR tbirds) they may have sat around for months or even years. Do the 7 '69 Tbirds have '69 pots? I don't know for sure, and I actually suspect not...

Thanks for the clarification. Makes sense.
Also on FlyGuitars, even Glenn Cornick said his first NR was one of a bunch sitting around since new and he got his in 1971.

[godofthunder]

 Center one says Dimarzio on it def. not original. I suppose I should check the pots on my birds.....................to be honest I was never that worked up about it.

[godofthunder]

 There was NOS sitting around for years, well into the 70's. I remember a bunch at the HOG.

[EvilLordJuju]

so that looks like a 1980 centralab pot (1348016) and an original  late '65 (week 52) - if original yours is a '66

[dadagoboi]

Do the 7 '69 Tbirds have '69 pots? I don't know for sure, and I actually suspect not...

True, but lacking a serial number do you know a better way than using pot codes to get an approximate date?  At the least they give you the earliest possible date the bass was produced.

[Denis]

If there was that much variation in certain aspects of these basses, then it's possible the serial number is on the headstock just not where he removed the paint. It could be up or down an inch and he would have missed it. We'll see.

so that looks like a 1980 centralab pot (1348016) and an original  late '65 (week 52) - if original yours is a '66

Neat, thanks!

There was NOS sitting around for years, well into the 70's. I remember a bunch at the HOG.

Ouch, don't you wish you'd bought a ton of them?

[godofthunder]

  My first was the used '68 bought in '77 or '78 by '79 or '80 I did acquired a NOS Thunderbird II that I owned till about '06 and sold at the height of NR fever, wish I never sold it. Serial numbers on these are pretty consistent stamped upside down and centered under the backing plate of the tuners.

[EvilLordJuju]

At the least they give you the earliest possible date the bass was produced.

well, again, it only gives an earliest date it was shipped. A bass can be assembled, and left in the factory without hardware... This didn't generally happen with EB0s and EB3s, but the obscure models, later EB0Fs for example often have a weird mix of parts from different years.

I have seen them with '65 pots and '66 pots - so far I have not seen any with '68 or '69 pots - but admittedly I haven't checked that many - Scott did yours have '68 pots?

A big change happened at Gibson in mid-late '66, Stan Rendell took over from Ted McCarty - he changed the Gibson's production system from one in which guitars were simply built, and hopefully sold, to one where guitars were built ONLY when ordered. The first non revs were built before his time - ie without any orders. We all know the stories of unsold Tbirds, so I doubt there were many orders coming in in '68 for them to build more...

It could be that they were all produced in '65 and '66, and slowly shipped, as required, potentially with hardware added in the year they were shipped?
Until a clearly later one comes up it's hard to be sure that there are indeed later ones...

[godofthunder]

 Over the weekend I am going to check the pot dates on my five NRs and see what we have. Another idiosyncrasy of NRs is mixed chrome and nickle hardware.

[godofthunder]

Ok I couldn't stand it, just checked my '69. The vol. pot is dated 66 and the tone is obscured. The wiring is original.