[Resurrected]

[Big_Stu]

The only Kiss I own now is "Alive II" on vinyl. I was given it as compensation by a mate who had had some of my borrowed vinyl nicked at a party. I played it so much that I swear half-way thru "Shock Me" I can hear my Dad shouting "TURN IT DOWN!" - maybe his voice was so loud that he reverse cut it into the vinyl! 
From hearing the 4th side I'm guessing a live situation was their element, like many classic bands. Awesome stage show, great theatrics, but Gene's "solo" could do with some work.
I'd love to try out a "Punisher", but never even seen one in the UK.

Further to my "6 Steps Removed" theory (elsewhere on this forum) "Kiss Alive" was named in tribute to "Slade Alive" as was "Rock N Roll All Nite" to Slade's mis-spelling of song titles....... "Without Slade there'd be no Kiss" according to Gene & Paul.

[uwe]

Thanks for the Kiss Army link, George, very interesting, especially this part of the Ezrin interview:


"KF: Speaking of which, Eddie Kramer, who would work with the band on the next two studio albums, "Rock And Roll Over" and "Love Gun," once said that, and I'm paraphrasing, "'Destroyer's a good record for a couple of tracks, but it really didn't sound like KISS."

Bob, what do you think of KISS' work with Eddie Kramer and was it more KISS sounding?

BE: Well, I think over the years what KISS have proven is that there's no such thing as "KISS sounding." They're an incredibly versatile group. There is a KISS attitude and a KISS style of lyric writing since there are characters [in the band].

But musically, they experimented more than of ton of other groups. So I think, at the time, Eddie was saying what some of the KISS fans were thinking, which was, "This isn't KISS." When in actuality the definition of the evolution of KISS went from being sort of a one-trick pony into actually being who they were. These guys were heavily influenced by the Beatles and other bands of the '60s. Their tastes were fairly wide-ranging. The kind of stuff that we wrote [on "Destroyer"] went all the way from pop to R&B. They just couldn't find a way to make it work in the context of a KISS album until we got to "Destroyer." And I think "Destroyer" holds up. I think it plays like a work of theater. You can imagine these costumed stage "monsters" prancing around and singing all this stuff. Even the softer stuff.

So I disagree with Eddie's characterization. But I wonder what he would say today."

My feelings exactly - I was sooooo disappointed when I heard Rock'n'Roll Over (dumb title too), it was retrogressive, sounded worse than Dressed to Kill in my ears. Destroyer was Kiss most successful album in Germany to date then so the move to Eddie Kramer kind of left you dumbfounded. But then I'm weird in that I tend to like the more polished sounding Kiss albums: Dressed to Kill, Destroyer, Dynasty (worth having for "Sure know something" alone), The Elder (yes, I like The Elder!), Crazy Nights (with the best Slade song on it Slade didn't write), Revenge and even Psycho Circus (the title track is a killer).

Kiss never made a secret of their admiration of Slade's music and their stage act. Stanley even copies Holder's habit of making announcements and talking with the audience in his singing voice (something Robert Plant or Ian Gillan never do) which I always deem a little artificial. The NME once gave a boisterous review of a Slade gig (after their return from the US post-punk) which concluded "they play the songs that Kiss crave for to accompany their visual act".

[uwe]

I don't have anything to add about Kiss or their bassist Chaim Weitz, I just wanted to say it's good to know Uwe isn't a raging racist.

Nope, just a socialist barrister - nothing wrong with that :

I hear tell he has a Che' poster and everything  

Danke schön, both of you. Indeed I have a pic of Che framed in my office (which makes my conservative partners always a tad bit uneasy), but he's more a pop icon to me than a political role model. Would be interesting though if he still lived today to hear what he would say.

Speaking of Chaim Witz aka Eugene Klein aka Gene $immon$: As a son of a teenage Auschwitz survivor Chaim has never been anything but courteous in Germany. When Kiss was catching flak - pun not intended - for using the SS runes in their logo (they have a different logo for German tours where the SS looks like a reversed ZZ)



and German reporters questioned him about it, it would have been easy for him to snap: "Hey, your parents and grandparents were wearing the SS uniform and tried to gas my mother, now go and play with your guilt and your model swastika!", but he never did, going out of his way to be friendly.  Instead there have always been nice comments about the German fan base which should probably be called KISS WEHRMACHT or something.   Other Jewish artists were a lot less forgiving: Paul Simon could not bring it over himself to tour Germany until the late eighties I believe and I perfectly understand that.

[gearHed289]

Up until the comments about Rock and Roll Over (my fav), I pretty much agree with everything Uwe has said here. I've had Resurrected since it came out, and I think it sounds great! The liner notes are especially interesting, giving insight to the fact that there wasn't a WHOLE lot Ezrin could do to it, with drums and guitars already sub-mixed to stereo tracks, effects having been printed to tape, etc. The dynamics and clarity (bye bye Phil Spector indeed!) make it a much better listen than the original. Most of the songs on Destroyer are great, though I NEVER cared for Great Ex. or Beth. The production always bothered me though, as I always wanted to hear them playing live. Now, drums sound better, bass sounds better, the upright bass on Beth sounds killer, etc. etc.

And my first concert - KISS, BOC, Johnny and Edgar Winter, Bob Segar.... August 29, 1976. Tickets were EIGHT dollars!

[uwe]

Rock'n"Roll Over has good songs, Hard Luck Woman, even if a Faces/Rod Stewart pastiche, is one of the best Paul Stanley songs ever. But in contrast to the sleek and elegant Destroyer sound, I found the Eddie Kramer production on it abrasive. But I'm no fan of Eddie Kramer's production style, period.

[Nocturnal]

I always liked Rock & Roll Over for it's energy and more raw sound. Haven't heard it in a while so I don't know how it has held up.

[uwe]

You should like Sonic Boom and the new one (Monster) then - they both consciously emulate the Rock'n'Roll Over sound.

Introducing the cowbell, harmony vocals and Gene Simmons melodic fills:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=abC5JTYkrHU&feature=related

[Hörnisse]

I wanted to recreate Simmon's tone on Dr. Love but never could.  I also liked the vocal harmonies on I Want You.

[Psycho Bass Guy]

I have the first "remaster" on CD, and it flat out sucks, period. It's all overdriven fake tape compression/distortion (early days of tape emulation plug-ins and they were VERY bad) and midrange from a WAY too hard-hit Empirical Labs Distressor. I still prefer hearing its tracks on the radio around here because most of the stations did in-house digital conversions of the original vinyl when they still had actual engineers working for them. Most classic rock stations in this area are my age or older and have had the same playlists for most of that time, only changing their 'branding' as their Boomer audience aged. It sounds like I'm defintely gonna have to check the "new" one, because I really like the songs on Destroyer.

FWIW, most of the  70's rock "remasters" from around that time sound like that. I have a Heart Greatest Hits CD that is literally unlistenable; more than 30 seconds and it just becomes grating. regardless of volume, it'll give me (and my wife) a headache. I freely admit to being a fidelity snob, but I'm not exaggertaing when I say there are a few CD's in my collection I wish I had never bought because of horrible "remastering."

[uwe]

Welcome to the club, I'm a fidelity snob too. MP3 is barbaric. So are many lovelessly done remasters.

Flash thought about Destroyer Resurrected: Ace Frehley is no Dick Wagner! The original solo on Sweet Pain is so bad that Ace should sue them. In comparison, Wagner's solo on the version we all know is a note-choice-perfect symphony.  No wonder Ezrin got short tempered with Ace who - unlike Gene, Paul and Peter - did not do his homework. That solo is so listless, badly phrased and overall uninspired ...

[gearHed289]

Yeah, it's fun hearing the original Ace solo, but it's clear why it didn't make the cut. And funny thing - Ace's version is in the regular track listing, and the album version is the "bonus track". That was the first thing I listened to, and I was like "I don't hear the difference?"   

Re-mix/Remaster disasters - ZZ Top and Kansas buried in reverb...

[godofthunder]

 I Look forward to picking this up while I liked Destroyer I found it weak and compressed sounding. I saw KISS on 5/10/75 on the tour that was to become Kiss Alive! One of the best shows I have ever seen and they fng rocked. The disc almost exactly mirrored the show I saw. Sure it was a bit contrived but they made it seem so spontaneous. Kiss Alive is still one of my all time favorite discs.

[Hörnisse]

This is one of the better remastered releases out there.   Very well done.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Complete_Greatest_Hits_(America_album)

[uwe]

The Rhino stuff usually is. They care.

[nofi]

the current remaster of sabbath's live evil is about the worst recording i have heard outside of a bootleg. i guess that's what happens when you cram a double album on to one cd. really, it sounds like it was recorded on a cassette in a boom box.