New Schaller bridge option for shortscales

uwe · March 18, 2011, 09:38:37 AM

I'm a major culprit, so I guess I have to say something:

It's like watching an accident. Horrible, but intriguing. Nazi Germany stands out as a high (or low) point in human evil, the fact that what was by and large a civilized nation could err so grotesquely has a dark, unsettling fascination. But shutting it away and making it a taboo is no way to deal with it.

And the Nazis, btw, hated jokes about themselves, they would murder you for it.

I can do all three: Marvel at the technology of a Kingtiger tank (but not forgetting that it was a means to a horrible end), crack low pc jokes about Nazi/German clichées (how does the saying go: "German jokes are no laughing matter!") and be devastated/shamed when seeing a concentration camp documentary. And if you read closely, then we have reasonable in depth discussions/comments on all three areas here in various threads though the screwball jokes are of course ze Löwenanteil, jawohl.

"Don't mention the war!" (Fawlty Towers)

was never for me. It deserves discussion again and again both from a historical/sociological perspective and as the controlling ritual of ridiculing demons.

No one here has ever seriously identified with or defended the Nazi mindset though. In another forum in another time with largely the same people we once had someone (not a member here) who defended Italian fascism along the lines of "it wasn't all bad, you're just not allowed to say that today" and he hit vocal disagreement from everyone like a brickwall. And the Italian fascists compared to the German Nazis like a goldfish does to a Great White.

Highlander · March 18, 2011, 02:45:17 PM

We don't have enough Mussolini here... we need balance...

Barklessdog · March 18, 2011, 03:06:33 PM

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ciSfd2zvb-k&feature=related

nofi · March 18, 2011, 04:32:23 PM

i guess all of this hit home when my dad recently wrote a book for me about his service in ww2. he had told me bits and pieces over the years but nothing really 'scary' to a young kid at the time. in his book he recounted how his entire unit was "slaughtered" in a german ambush. he and a few others survived. needles to say this was big news to me. he also served in the pacific theater and likes to say he was bombed by both enemies. i'm glad he is still alive and healthy at 86 because before too long there will no one left to tell the tale.

sniper · March 18, 2011, 06:30:05 PM

Quote from: uwe on March 18, 2011, 09:38:37 AM
I'm a major culprit, so I guess I have to say something:

It's like watching an accident. Horrible, but intriguing. Nazi Germany stands out as a high (or low) point in human evil, the fact that what was by and large a civilized nation could err so grotesquely has a dark, unsettling fascination. But shutting it away and making it a taboo is no way to deal with it.

And the Nazis, btw, hated jokes about themselves, they would murder you for it.

I can do all three: Marvel at the technology of a Kingtiger tank (but not forgetting that it was a means to a horrible end), crack low pc jokes about Nazi/German clichées (how does the saying go: "German jokes are no laughing matter!") and be devastated/shamed when seeing a concentration camp documentary. And if you read closely, then we have reasonable in depth discussions/comments on all three areas here in various threads though the screwball jokes are of course ze Löwenanteil, jawohl.

"Don't mention the war!" (Fawlty Towers)

was never for me. It deserves discussion again and again both from a historical/sociological perspective and as the controlling ritual of ridiculing demons.

No one here has ever seriously identified with or defended the Nazi mindset though. In another forum in another time with largely the same people we once had someone (not a member here) who defended Italian fascism along the lines of "it wasn't all bad, you're just not allowed to say that today" and he hit vocal disagreement from everyone like a brickwall. And the Italian fascists compared to the German Nazis like a goldfish does to a Great White.

I strongly suggest if one ever gets the chance to go through the Aberdeen Proving Ground Museum, Aberdeen Maryland, just off I95 and check out the German tanks and guns there.

uwe · March 18, 2011, 07:06:12 PM

And all credit to your dad for that, Nofi, not only did he survive, but he risked his life for the right values. And even for my freedom though I share the same gene pool with the ambushers. America isn't always automatically right, but it sure was in WW II. Give your old man my regards.

lowend1 · March 18, 2011, 08:14:24 PM

Quote from: nofi on March 18, 2011, 04:32:23 PM
i guess all of this hit home when my dad recently wrote a book for me about his service in ww2. he had told me bits and pieces over the years but nothing really 'scary' to a young kid at the time. in his book he recounted how his entire unit was "slaughtered" in a german ambush. he and a few others survived. needles to say this was big news to me. he also served in the pacific theater and likes to say he was bombed by both enemies. i'm glad he is still alive and healthy at 86 because before too long there will no one left to tell the tale.

My dad is still kicking at 90. He came here from Germany in 1929 and wound up manning an American machine gun at Anzio. Ultimately, frozen feet got him transferred from combat to West Point, where some German POWs were held - they promoted him to sergeant and made him an interpreter for the duration of his time in the army.

eb2 · March 18, 2011, 08:41:11 PM

My dad was in the Atlantic and Pacific with the Navy when he was 17. His stories were few and far between - usually about food, and how he always gives money to the Salvation Army because they gave the soldiers donuts for free. He still doesn't talk too much about stuff, but I found out his ship managed to shoot down a Kamikazee before it hit them. He is a big fan of German weaponry, but liked his Arisaka. He hates Nazis. So do I. But I do find the whole mess fascinating, and while we have some fun with the odd-ball stuff of a cow with a swastika on its head, I don't think anyone here is making light of the horror.

The 3rd Reich should be fascinating though. In the 30's there were a disturbing large number of Americans who were in awe of Hitler. No one likes to talk about that too much. And they respected Musollini too, including FDR (post-war white washing of that is all over).

And when it gets too far in one direction, we can always talk about Sheryl Crow again.

Pilgrim · March 18, 2011, 08:57:03 PM

I'm a whole lot more fascinated with shiny basses than with Nazis. But I do get a kick out of the weird ideas people associate with them (see "space Nazis" above). There seems to be no idea so ridiculous that someone won't tag the word "Nazis" onto it.

Dave W · March 18, 2011, 11:08:43 PM

exiledarchangel · March 19, 2011, 02:39:27 AM

Hey, Nazis burned my village to the ground, but I still wanna talk/joke about them! Guess what? I am even trying to learn their barbaric language!

I don't know the meaning of the word "taboo" I guess...

Highlander · March 19, 2011, 06:12:15 AM

Quote from: nofi on March 18, 2011, 04:32:23 PM
... i'm glad he is still alive and healthy at 86 because before too long there will no one left to tell the tale.

I have that issue with my work - ten years trying to find someone to talk about events in Burma and then...

A book privately published (posthumously - Freddie Patterson - "From Rattray And Beyond - a 1st Cameronian like my father, born same year) last year with valuable insights from a survivor of the same event my dad went through (I lost him in '01 but he left a stack of notes)
His widow has just sent me a personally autographed copy of Alistair Urquhart's "The Forgotten Highlander" - he lives locally to her - just arrived this morning - a Changi survivor and he even witnessed Nagasaki as he survived a "Hellboat" trip and was camped near by - he's now 91)
The early release of the Battalion (111th Indian Division - scheduled for release in 2045) diaries - 800 or so pages with down-to-the-minute detail (and I have now found I turned over two pages when photographing them!!!)...
Another book by Major Bill Towill recently published (3/9th Gurhkas - at "Blackpool" for last 5 days and the evac after the wipe-out and over-run - he is also 91, lives about 8 miles from here, and has agreed to meet up - willing to assist and has a lot of unpublished material on the events)...
There are two 1st Cameronians (again same age as my father would have been - born '23) that are actively talking to me - one of them thinks he remembers my dad...

My cup runeth over, floods the front room, blows the fuses... ah... what am I doing here - so much to do... so little time...