It’s official … 4005

[uwe]

Sibling rivalry is always entertaining if it's not in your family.

And Liam is of course - or better used to be - a mouthful of a mouthful. I grant him though that he has developed as a musician while Noel is kinda stuck in one place.

[ilan]

For me the lack of a hugely influential bass player associated with a 4005 is a bonus. I don't like looking like a fanboy.

[uwe]

That and how no one will ask you whether it is a good bass for heavy metal!

There is certainly a scarcity of Rickenbacker guitars in heavy (be it rock or metal) groups, they are even rarer than Telecasters (which with Status Quo found at least some hard rock usage). The heaviest guitarist playing a Rickenbacker guitar in his early days was probably Pete Townshend, but it’s kind of hard to picture them with, say, Van Halen, Judas Priest, Kiss, Iron Maiden, Metallica, Accept or Scorpions!

[ilan]

It seems that Rickenbacker guitars are used mostly in alt and indie rock, and I suspect it has a lot to do with their retro aesthetics – you don't look very alternative with a Strat or Les Paul. Personally I never found their 6-string guitars useful or comfortable. To me they sound a bit cheap and tinny.

[Alanko]

For me the lack of a hugely influential bass player associated with a 4005 is a bonus. I don't like looking like a fanboy.

Mani from the Stone Roses is the lone bassist I can think of who used one. Even then, I can't think of a specific identifiable 4005 tone jumping out their records. He uses Jack Casady basses these days.

[morrow]

Early Steppenwolf pics have everybody with Transonic amps and Rickenbacker instruments , including a 4005.

[Dave W]

Teles rare in hard rock? What about Ray Davies, Jimmy Page and Eric Clapton, among others?

[uwe]

They exist, but not as prevalently as Strats, Les Pauls, SGs, Flying Vs and Explorers.

I’d say in hard and heavy rock about as frequent as Firebirds?

I know of Page’s Whole Lotta Love solo Tele of course, but did Clapton use a Tele with Cream much? Post-Cream I wouldn’t rate him as a hard rocker and my hunch is that he wouldn’t either. I see his whole post-Cream career as a quest to morph from hard rock guitar god to respected singer/songwriter who also plays well guitar, but in a way serving the song. That said, Layla is probably a hard rock song …

Townshend was of course another hard rock’ish Tele shape player for a while, that Schecter Tele he began using in the 80ies.

Anyway, I was not implying that a Tele can’t work in a heavy environment (one listen to the orgastic Whole Lotta Love solo disproves that), just that they are rare for likely visual reasons. Picture Paul Stanley with a Tele, it doesn’t work.

As regards the Ric hollow body guitars, however, it seems safe to assume that their scarcity in trad. hard rock/heavy metal has to do with their sonics not really lending themselves to that type of music. And it’s not just the hollow body aspect, Blackmore played his solo on Child In Time with an ES-335 and used it live as late as still 1969/70, Alvin immortalized himself at Woodstock with an ES-335 too and then there is always Uncle Ted’s Byrdland. But Speed King, I’m Going Home or Stranglehold with a Rickenbacker 330? I have my doubts.

[ilan]

It's more about the pickups than body construction. Jingle-jangly single coils are good for retro and indie, heavier genres call for humbuckers.

Lennon's 325 looked fantastic but it can't hold a candle to George's Gretsch tone.

[Jeff Scott]

We also had Peter Banks with a 330 in Yes.

[Alanko]

It's more about the pickups than body construction. Jingle-jangly single coils are good for retro and indie, heavier genres call for humbuckers.

Lennon's 325 looked fantastic but it can't hold a candle to George's Gretsch tone.

Lennon's woody, zero-sustain and badly intonated 325 is like the real rhythm keeper on those early Beatles cuts! It kept right out the way of George's lead lines and drove the songs along. Not a tone I would want to be getting, but quite recognisable.

[Dave W]

They exist, but not as prevalently as Strats, Les Pauls, SGs, Flying Vs and Explorers.

I’d say in hard and heavy rock about as frequent as Firebirds?

I know of Page’s Whole Lotta Love solo Tele of course, but did Clapton use a Tele with Cream much? Post-Cream I wouldn’t rate him as a hard rocker and my hunch is that he wouldn’t either. I see his whole post-Cream career as a quest to morph from hard rock guitar god to respected singer/songwriter who also plays well guitar, but in a way serving the song. That said, Layla is probably a hard rock song …

Townshend was of course another hard rock’ish Tele shape player for a while, that Schecter Tele he began using in the 80ies.

Anyway, I was not implying that a Tele can’t work in a heavy environment (one listen to the orgastic Whole Lotta Love solo disproves that), just that they are rare for likely visual reasons. Picture Paul Stanley with a Tele, it doesn’t work.

As regards the Ric hollow body guitars, however, it seems safe to assume that their scarcity in trad. hard rock/heavy metal has to do with their sonics not really lending themselves to that type of music. And it’s not just the hollow body aspect, Blackmore played his solo on Child In Time with an ES-335 and used it live as late as still 1969/70, Alvin immortalized himself at Woodstock with an ES-335 too and then there is always Uncle Ted’s Byrdland. But Speed King, I’m Going Home or Stranglehold with a Rickenbacker 330? I have my doubts.

Teles less prevalent in hard rock than Flying Vs and Explorers? I don't think so!

Clapton played a Tele with Strat neck in Blind Faith's Hyde Park debut and was seen with it in Cream in that Danish movie. He also played it onstage with Delaney and Bonnie. He has said that a Tele has been at least somewhere on all his albums. Fender Custom Shop issued a run of 50 Blind Faith Teles about 5 years ago, IIRC with a price tag above $15K.

Back to Rics, I think any type of music can sound good on a 330 or 360, even if not ideal.

[ilan]

Lennon's woody, zero-sustain and badly intonated 325 is like the real rhythm keeper on those early Beatles cuts! It kept right out the way of George's lead lines and drove the songs along. Not a tone I would want to be getting, but quite recognisable.

They did have a clear good tone / bad tone strategy, but personally when choosing a guitar I'm more inclined to go for the good tone shelf rather than the so-bad-it's-immediately-recognizable. But to each their own 

I will give them this — when Paul came back from the store with his new Epi Casino, John and George immediately ordered theirs. And it did not compromise their performance. John could still get his signature crappy tone, and George, you know, could make anyhing sound good.

[Dave W]

Sustain is vastly overrated.

[uwe]

"Sustain is vastly overrated."