Gibson Announces New Leadership Team

Alanko · January 06, 2019, 03:07:40 PM

Quote from: Dave W on January 05, 2019, 02:50:18 PM
ffs, what a bunch of idiots (with some sane comments thrown in).

I think the only thing that would make that forum happy would be for Gibson to make instruments at Chinese import prices.

Dave W · January 06, 2019, 07:48:06 PM

Quote from: Alanko on January 06, 2019, 03:07:40 PM
I think the only thing that would make that forum happy would be for Gibson to make instruments at Chinese import prices.

That's probably also true over there for Rics and American made Fenders. No understanding of what goes into cost and pricing.

Irrational Gibson and MusicMan hatred is great sport at TB, but nothing beats the Ric threads I've seen there. If you want to talk pluses and minuses of owning a Ric, that's fair game. It's a strange company with features that are quaint to lot of players. I don't think it's fair game when somebody just asks a question and immediately dozens of posters chime in with a litany of everything they think is wrong, when it has nothing to do with whatever the question was. Very odd.

doombass · January 07, 2019, 02:19:21 AM

Too many people (especially when they're online) don't understand when their subjective (and sometimes objective) opinions are totally unnecessary to post.

ajkula66 · January 07, 2019, 07:24:18 AM

Quote from: Alanko on January 06, 2019, 03:07:40 PM
I think the only thing that would make that forum happy would be for Gibson to make instruments at Chinese import prices.

Even that wouldn't suffice given what I've seen over the past two years that I've been on that forum. The amount of vitriol that the very mention of Gibson - and to a lesser extent, Rickenbacker - name brings is something that I'll never understand. But, I guess I'm an old dog who really doesn't understand Internet...

Dave W · January 07, 2019, 06:22:04 PM

Every article I read about the Gibson bankruptcy -- on business and financial sites, guitar magazine sites, Nashville newspaper sites -- made it clear that Gibson's guitar business was profitable, and that the problem was the debt from the consumer electronics companies Henry bought.

Yet in every thread I saw on every forum except ours, and on every music site where comments are allowed, loads of posters filled the threads with their opinions about what Gibson absolutely has to do to save its guitar business. Do these people not read the articles, or just have no ability to understand what they're reading? Or maybe it's just blind hatred of Gibson.

I'm sure the new management will make changes, hopefully they'll scrap Henry's plan to force innovation on everybody. Time will tell.

Psycho Bass Guy · January 07, 2019, 07:12:57 PM

Quote from: Dave W on January 07, 2019, 06:22:04 PM
Every article I read about the Gibson bankruptcy -- on business and financial sites, guitar magazine sites, Nashville newspaper sites -- made it clear that Gibson's guitar business was profitable, and that the problem was the debt from the consumer electronics companies Henry bought.

Yet in every thread I saw on every forum except ours, and on every music site where comments are allowed, loads of posters filled the threads with their opinions about what Gibson absolutely has to do to save its guitar business. Do these people not read the articles, or just have no ability to understand what they're reading?

It's the grand old American tradition of talking out of your ass to try and feel more important than you actually are.

I will say that Henry's firings of longtime staff and craftsmen probably did severe damage TO the instrument manufacturing side, so it may become indirectly relevant.

ajkula66 · January 07, 2019, 07:36:27 PM

Quote from: Dave W on January 07, 2019, 06:22:04 PM
Do these people not read the articles, or just have no ability to understand what they're reading? Or maybe it's just blind hatred of Gibson.

Hate. The origins of which I have yet to understand.

doombass · January 08, 2019, 12:19:19 AM

I think it's mostly because those morons are too lazy to read beyond the headlines.

FrankieTbird · January 08, 2019, 07:58:35 AM

Quote from: Dave W on January 07, 2019, 06:22:04 PM
Every article I read about the Gibson bankruptcy -- on business and financial sites, guitar magazine sites, Nashville newspaper sites -- made it clear that Gibson's guitar business was profitable, and that the problem was the debt from the consumer electronics companies Henry bought.

Yet in every thread I saw on every forum except ours, and on every music site where comments are allowed, loads of posters filled the threads with their opinions about what Gibson absolutely has to do to save its guitar business. Do these people not read the articles, or just have no ability to understand what they're reading? Or maybe it's just blind hatred of Gibson.

I'm sure the new management will make changes, hopefully they'll scrap Henry's plan to force innovation on everybody. Time will tell.

I think a lot of the animosity comes from Gibson hawking their guitars to the "blues lawyers". Lots of working people feel slighted by that marketing approach. I mean, how many guys do you see playing a $10K Les Paul in the local dive bar?

Dave W · January 08, 2019, 11:00:54 PM

Quote from: FrankieTbird on January 08, 2019, 07:58:35 AM

I think a lot of the animosity comes from Gibson hawking their guitars to the "blues lawyers". Lots of working people feel slighted by that marketing approach. I mean, how many guys do you see playing a $10K Les Paul in the local dive bar?

Really? I don't think so. The majority of Gibson's marketing has been aimed at the more affordable end of the market, where the overwhelming amount of their sales are.

"Blues lawyers" are definitely Fender territory. SRV/Strat/tweed territory. You do see guys playing vintage and Custom Shop Strats in local bars.

Listen.

Dave W · January 09, 2019, 10:29:51 PM

No need to gripe about what Henry may do next now that he's no longer in control, but I have to share this, from another forum.

"Henry J; The Answer Man to all the questions that nobody ever asks. The solution man to problems that don't exist, the guru to a lifestyle that nobody else lives in."

Alanko · January 10, 2019, 04:17:06 AM

Quote from: Dave W on January 07, 2019, 06:22:04 PMDo these people not read the articles, or just have no ability to understand what they're reading? Or maybe it's just blind hatred of Gibson.

I think a lot of the blind hatred stems from a weird, oedipal desire to own Gibsons from people who can't afford them for whatever reason. I think the same applies to Rickenbacker instruments. Discuss Rickenbackers online for long enough and people will start suggesting Rickenbacker should start cheaper offshore production, and bring in a budget range. Or how Rickenbacker should reissue the 4005 and sell it for 4003 prices.

Yesterday some guy was whining on Facebook that Rickenbacker weren't manufacturing 4080 basses, and that RIC need to study supply and demand (big LOL). I pointed out that Paul W would build you a 4080 bass if you have the readies. Silence! People don't want answers, only reasons to complain about why they can't have the nice shiny thing tomorrow. Guitarists and bassists are good at imagining manufacturers have a moral obligation to make the instruments they want at a price they can afford.

As Dave points out, Gibson lost their shirt on the consumer electronics side of the business. They didn't go bankrupt because they had the audacity to charge more than $1000 for a guitar! Gibson brought out those weird 100-year Les Paul guitars with the hologram on the headstock, and my local Gibson retailer sold every last one of them. Gibson instruments clearly sell to somebody, if not noisy forum dwellers.

And finally, sit down with an inflation calculator and the 1959 Gibson catalog. Gibson prices are basically much the same as they were in 1959; guitarists are just generally too dim to realise this, and think that $265 in 1959 (the catalog price of a 'burst) is the same as $265 today. Probably the same people buy a $300 Chibson because it is "just as good", then spend $300 on pickups, $200 on components and hardware, $100 on a setup...

gearHed289 · January 10, 2019, 07:58:57 AM

Quote from: Alanko on January 10, 2019, 04:17:06 AMI pointed out that Paul W would build you a 4080 bass if you have the readies. Silence! People don't want answers, only reasons to complain about why they can't have the nice shiny thing tomorrow.

THIS! ^^^

The 4005 comment is a good one as well. Some people have some kind of fantasy idea about how many of these things the company will actually be able to sell.

doombass · January 21, 2019, 04:58:52 AM

Another article hinting that the new management will be a change of mindset. Does not mention basses though.

https://www.prnewswire.com/news-releases/gibson-reveals-exciting-new-product-line-up-and-artist-collaborations-ahead-of-winter-namm-300781081.html

Grog · January 21, 2019, 11:41:45 AM

I've had several guitars that I bought in the past bookmarked in my browser. I just noticed that all of them have been erased & the beginning of the 2019 lineup seems to have taken their place. Almost as if the new management doesn't want to look back at the past, just look forward. When Henry J took things over from Norlin, they didn't seem interested in helping with information or parts from Norlin era guitars. Maybe that is happening again.

Here is what I had bookmarked from my ES Les Paul Bass..............

https://www.gibson.com/Guitars/Les%20Paul