Gibson Mona-Steel Strings

[uwe]

There is only that much you can write about a set of strings, right?

California State Convict Spector's legendary Wall of Sound is an acquired taste. RDMH took all blackness out of Tina's growl and the orchestral part that marshmallows over the music is sloppy and has no warmth. It was not only jealousy that let Ike Turner be aghast at the result.  ATMP cannot be listened to in its entirety for the headache-producing billowing sound alone, Harrison's compositions can't be blamed. And let's not forget that the old marksman is the only person on earth who is responsible for both the worst Beatles album AND the worst Ramones one! 

[eb2]

He found something really original - influential - and then worked it over and over to death.  End of The Century is a pleasant exception as the Ramones did well with a 50's RnB sax section, I think.  But I appreciate Let It Be Naked.

Still, Phil Spector is a much less grating experience than the cookie-cutter Motown "break out the tambourine" production that got completely annoying. I can't stand that junk.

[Dave W]

He found something really original - influential - and then worked it over and over to death.  End of The Century is a pleasant exception as the Ramones did well with a 50's RnB sax section, I think.  But I appreciate Let It Be Naked.

I wonder how that session would have worked out if Phil hadn't pulled a gun on them and locked them in.

Still, Phil Spector is a much less grating experience than the cookie-cutter Motown "break out the tambourine" production that got completely annoying. I can't stand that junk.

Amen, brother. OTOH that's exactly what being "Hitsville USA" was all about.

[Hornisse]

You really have to experience the Spector and Motown stuff on vinyl.  There is a difference, kind of like the sound differences between Poly and Nitro finishes.   My original 1964 Four Tops LP Baby I Need Your Loving just breathes on the stereo.  And I mean a good stereo with a great turntable.   Digital and MP3's of this type of music just can't compare. 

[eb2]

And there is another problem - the best mixes of that era were the mono mixes.  None of the 60s Motown singles were recorded with stereo in mind - the stereo mixes were afterthoughts.  A lot of times they were done after the song had been released and been a hit, and they needed a stereo mix for lp.  The stereo mixes very often sound neither like the hit 45 version, nor balanced very well in stereo.  A long-running complaint for the Motown comp and cd reissues is they used wrong mixes that sound tinny.

A good Motown read:

http://www.stevehoffman.tv/forums/archive/index.php/t-932.html

[nofi]

i like mono. people may have two ears but they certainly don't hear in stereo. mono is closer to real life hearing i think.

[Dave W]

Production and stereo vs. mono issues aside, it's just not the type of music I like. OTOH I certainly give them credit for knowing how to pump out the hits.

[Pilgrim]

Gotta agree with Dave that most of the time the wall of sound thing is too busy...

I like it on most cuts - different, but distinctive.  But that's why different production techniques appeal to different people.  The endless Mariah Carey-style verbal vibrato and backup singers covering the (often questionable) voice of the lead singer are things I emphatically dislike.  Evidently lots of people like them.

[Dave W]

I like it on most cuts - different, but distinctive.  But that's why different production techniques appeal to different people.  The endless Mariah Carey-style verbal vibrato and backup singers covering the (often questionable) voice of the lead singer are things I emphatically dislike.  Evidently lots of people like them.

That Mariah Carey-style verbal vibrato is called melisma. 

It's not always bad, but I can't stand the way it's used in pop music.

[Pilgrim]

Great link, Dave!

This quote from the target link sums it up: "Often, there isn't any musical justification of what they are doing. [Their runs] interfere with the flow of the melody, of the lyric, of the harmonies, sometimes of the rhythm itself. It's frequently a very vulgar and ugly display. [That's] the style of American Idol singers, most of whom are amateurs. [They] are simply mimicking the devices of the style's most famous practitioners — singers like Mariah Carey, who indulge in runs."

[Stjofön Big]

Can only agree! Great link!

[uwe]

Mariah Carey is to girl singers today what EvH was to budding guitarist 20 years ago. It's the exhibition of technical craft. That has always been an element in pop, rock or jazz. Like hammer on solos, it will reach its peak (probably has already) and then gradually decline. Carey's use of falsetto harmonics has certainly been influential on a lot of female singers and she is credted by them for that. It is surprising how many women singers who play totally different music cite her as an (often early) influence. Let the girls have their Eddie too. I did like her version of Can't Live, the Badfinger song made famous by Nillson.

[Basvarken]

How did a thread about ancient Gibson strings end up in a thread about Mariah Carey?

[Dave W]

How did a thread about ancient Gibson strings end up in a thread about Mariah Carey?

Steel strings can be abrasive.

Mariah Carey can be abrasive.

Makes perfect sense to me.

[uwe]

And I didn't even get it! Went for 50 dollars, bit much for a set of strings well beyond their best use date.

I should have bid on Mariah instead. Judging from more recent pics she's eating properly now and should be a wholesome package.

One thing to her defense: Her voice has held up a whole lot better than Whitney's!