The Last Bass Outpost
Gear Discussion Forums => Gibson Basses => Topic started by: godofthunder on March 14, 2013, 03:29:50 AM
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I just saw pictures of the 50th anniversary Thunderbird at the H.O.G. yesterday! Bullion gold, with special black pg and .....................are you ready for this GOLD hardware! Same old same old black TB Plus pickups. Uwe, it's a shame you don't collect finishes ;D. Available sometime between May and June.
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WOW. That's sounds so UNappealing.... What is their problem??? Does it have a big headstock?? Probably NO... I can't believe "Gold Hardware and a black pickguard" makes this a special bass... Sounds like a real disappointment...
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Yeah....You would think Gibson would do a CORRECT 50th Anniversary TBird, with the correct large headstock and PUPs and the original body contour...or at least ALL gold hardware, including the PUPs. But it's bogus without the original headstock and metal PUP covers of some color.
I also imagine no TBird II version?
Black plastic....BLEECK!!!
Maybe Henry owns a big black plastic vibrator he loves?
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Darn Tootin'! We try to be loyal to the brand and Gibson just keeps slapping us bass players in the face. C'mon everybody, grab your torches and pitchforks and head to Nashville!
and then we'll get Henry J
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yq1KeyEARBU
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Gold paint AND gold hardware? Hmm... Pass...
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A pic of it would be nice, but I'd have to agree a 50th Anniversery 'Bird just isn't going to be "right" with black plastic parts...................
Chrome Rules! Accept no substitute ;)
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No one should expect a "new" Thunderbird to have an oversized headstock, or vintage spec pups. Might get lucky on the chrome hardware someday (ala the regular Studios) but the smaller headstock is a design improvement that isn't going away; and neither are the black TB+ pickups. That all said - I'm interested to see this one. There was a bullion gold custom shop bird on Ebay a while ago:
(http://i.ebayimg.com/t/Gibson-Thunderbird-Bass-Custom-Shop-Bouillon-Gold-/00/s/MTYwMFgxMjAw/z/z6MAAMXQbjxRBXK6/$T2eC16VHJHQE9nzEylpDBRB(K5EK1w~~60_57.JPG)
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I agree with one of Uwe's earlier statements that Gibson has actually done a lot for bassists in the past couple of years. The RD, Grabber, Ripper, G-3 and NR T-bird reissues and a few others.
Mostly, I think the complaints that they do nothing for bassists REALLY should be translated as "they do nothing for old T-bird users who want old, but new, T-birds".
;D
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I like how the newer ones play just fine and I don't mind the small headstock either. But, I really like the look of clover tuners like Hipshots - I'd pay a little more if Gibson used them no problem. I personally like the 3 point bridge, but they have a two point that was used on the Les Paul OSB, why not use it? Obviously they can chrome plate pickups, they did on the Flying V........ They just need to get it together instead of shooting themselves in the foot yet again.
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No one should expect a "new" Thunderbird to have an oversized headstock, or vintage spec pups. Might get lucky on the chrome hardware someday (ala the regular Studios) but the smaller headstock is a design improvement that isn't going away; and neither are the black TB+ pickups. That all said - I'm interested to see this one. There was a bullion gold custom shop bird on Ebay a while ago:
(http://i.ebayimg.com/t/Gibson-Thunderbird-Bass-Custom-Shop-Bouillon-Gold-/00/s/MTYwMFgxMjAw/z/z6MAAMXQbjxRBXK6/$T2eC16VHJHQE9nzEylpDBRB(K5EK1w~~60_57.JPG)
Is it me, or does that headstock look bigger than average?
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It's the Maxwell Smart Business plan "missed it by this much". Gold with chrome and a traditional w/b/w pg would be killer. And while their at it use the two piece bridge w/ tailpiece. You really have to wonder wtf they are thinking.
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They're thinking let's throw out a product with the same parts (3 point bridge) we use on a bunch of other basses to save cost, use more plastic because it's cheaper, put no effort into reproducing the sixties pickup because it would be to costly to produce, then throw a Gibson badge on it and suckers still line up to buy it.
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Then I guess we should stop buying them.
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Scott...! Heresy...! :o
Wash your mouth out with soap...
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"but the smaller headstock is a design improvement that isn't going away"
Amen - no one here has yet explained to me what acoustic benefit the larger headstock brought. I know that it broke more easily though. Anything to stay original, right? :mrgreen:
"Mostly, I think the complaints that they do nothing for bassists REALLY should be translated as "they do nothing for old T-bird users who want old, but new, T-birds"."
Doupleplusgood-Amen, sums the reactionary forces here up perfectly.
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I might make an exception from my solemn vow for this one - who knows?
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really, how hard would it have been to have put on the bridge and tailpiece and chrome(or gold) tb plus pickups? even if the 3 point is the epitome of bridge design. ??? i think at least a token nod to its heritage would have been a nice idea on a 50th anniversary thunderbird.pity.probably still a nice bass though.
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I think they could have done gold hardware and pups.
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Gibson should offer two necks (a normal and a wider/fatter) and some pickup variation IMHO on TBs, instead of going the fender way and just offer the same thing in different colors.
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After all the other modern Thunderbird variations, no one should be surprised that this one is mostly the same. In all fairness to Gibson, they're calling it an anniversary model, not a reissue.
Of course, they could do a real vintage reissue, just like they could have done a vintage NR reissue. They just choose not to.
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... Of course, they could do a real vintage reissue...
Pre-snapped and reset head option...?
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how about 50 years worth of sweat and beer pre applied?could be worth a premium price...
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how about 50 years worth of sweat and beer pre applied?could be worth a premium price...
It works for Fender!
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Well, I saw the picture too and I think it is kinda nice looking. I do agree the black pups look out of place with the gold everywhere else. But hey, it's Gibson. Why spend a few hundred bucks tooling up for some metal covers when you can put same old plastic crap on and dopes will buy them?
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It's not like they haven't done it before:
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v47/gcarlston/Thunderbirds/Thunderbirdinpurple01.jpg)
Posted here last year: http://bassoutpost.com/index.php?topic=6922.45
Myself, I think the gold finish would look great with black hardware.
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"but the smaller headstock is a design improvement that isn't going away"
Amen - no one here has yet explained to me what acoustic benefit the larger headstock brought. I know that it broke more easily though. Anything to stay original, right? :mrgreen:
"Mostly, I think the complaints that they do nothing for bassists REALLY should be translated as "they do nothing for old T-bird users who want old, but new, T-birds"."
I guess you might like to argue with Jeff Ament regarding "bigger is better," regarding headstock size and body size. All his custom Hamers and his Lulls have oversized bodies or headstocks....supposedly more mass = more sustain/tone.
As far as all the other specs....if it is a "50th Anniversary" TBird, IMO it should spec like an original 1964 TBird and maybe add some bling like gold plating or custom color.
Or else it is just another typical Gibson pseudo "special/limited edition" with an upcharge for a color change with an added decal.
Hell...it's not like they can't just go on EBAY and BUY 100 gold TBird covers fi they don't want to pay to have them tooled/made. Come to think of it....Henry might consider just contracting out 100 "50th Anniversary TBirds" to any one of the small builders who would do it better than Gibson...and just slap a "Gibson Custom Shop" label on them and double the price.
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I like large headstocks too (not that the current TBs feature a small one), for looks, but that they affect sound in a positive way is a myth. I've played basses with tiny or no headstocks at all with endless sustain.
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Steinbergers....Kubickis...I don't think the headstock weight does anything for tone.
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I've read somewhere that some extra weight on the headstock helps eliminate dead spots, thats why some people like Sheehan put this weight thingie on their headstocks.
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:mrgreen: "neckdives like Stuka over Poland"
That dead spot elimination thing always struck me as vodoo acoustics. Any scientific defenders?
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I've seen threads on other forums where guys talked about adding weights to the headstock to eliminate dead spots. They claimed it was successful. Here's a couple weighty ones that I'm sure don't have dead spots ;D
(http://i1151.photobucket.com/albums/o632/4stringer77/Joan/Brigitte/I-like-girls-who-can-take-big-bananas_zps8993fe28.jpg)
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Well that reminds me of a joke................
I'll keep it to myself tho ;)
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I've seen threads on other forums where guys talked about adding weights to the headstock to eliminate dead spots. They claimed it was successful. Here's a couple weighty ones that I'm sure don't have dead spots ;D
(http://i1151.photobucket.com/albums/o632/4stringer77/Joan/Brigitte/I-like-girls-who-can-take-big-bananas_zps8993fe28.jpg)
I like the way you're thinking, gotta tell you this... ;)
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Dead spots is something the basses from that other brand fom Planet Boltonia have ...
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Oh, holy crud.
Use the camera for good, not for evil!
A possible antidote...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rNYrqN1mVec
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Dead spots is something the basses from that other brand fom Planet Boltonia have ...
You're kidding, right? It can happen with any bass. My EB-0L had dead spots in the usual G string frets and some hot spots on the E. I've had a couple of Ricks with multiple dead spots.
A respected acoustic guitar builder has said that one of the factors is placing the bridge near the end of the body which creates antinodes that affect notes in certain locations. Not that it's the only factor, and of course with a long scale bass, most common body designs make it hard to place the bridge well away from the end.
Adding a fat finger or other weight to the headstock isn't voodoo. It may shift the "dead" frequency enough to where the note blooms again, but sometimes it doesn't have any effect at all.
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I find dead spots relatively seldom on Gibsons, maybe maho isn't as dead spot-prone. I've had it on Rics too. Sometimes, even changing (to another brand of) strings helps.
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My piezo basses all have a serious dead spot..."A"s on the Guild..."Eb"s on the Pace
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As far as I'm concerned, all Gibson has to do is clone Uwe's CS "Buchholz" Bird. It remains, for me, the coolest "reissue" I've seen.
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I find dead spots relatively seldom on Gibsons, maybe maho isn't as dead spot-prone. I've had it on Rics too. Sometimes, even changing (to another brand of) strings helps.
Mahogany may not be as prone. Short scales may not be as prone. Changing strings may give you a frequency curve that's different enough to make the dead spot less noticeable.
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Changing strings may give you a frequency curve that's different enough to make the dead spot less noticeable.
More likely is that different strings will have a different tension distribution across the neck and body and physically move the node points that create dead spots.
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I always thought it was a bolt on neck thing???
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More likely is that different strings will have a different tension distribution across the neck and body and physically move the node points that create dead spots.
That's quite possible too, at least in some cases.
I always thought it was a bolt on neck thing???
No. It may be more common with bolt ons, but set necks and neck thrus have them too.
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It's also a case where through-bridge or through-body stringing could make a difference as well. I've "fixed" dead spots with trussrod tweaks and action adjustments, too. They're more common on the "G" because a 34" scale is the proper length for the vibration period of G, which means that nodes are going to be larger, too. In Rics and other neck-through basses, the rules change because the headstock and bridge are both interacting on the same piece of wood, where on a bolt-on, the difference in headstock pitch is a larger factor. On a set-neck, everything depends entirely on the quality of the joint and the length of the tenon.
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More likely is that different strings will have a different tension distribution across the neck and body and physically move the node points that create dead spots.
That's what I meant. Not new set vs old set but set from a different brand or at least a different gauge. I always attributed it to variations in tensions.
But the wood must be a factor too - I only have dead spots on maple neck basses though even among those there is not a really severe case. It's a piece of wood after all, don't expect eyery area to sound the same. In fact, I always find playing my Status Stealth II with its one piece body and neck where every darn note played anywhere has pretty much the exact same sonic quality and texture as the notes around it kind of disturbing. Feels weird, as if you were playing an electronic keyboard and only triggering a sound. OTOH, if I played only that bass for a year or so, I'd probably be spoiled for life for any wooden bass! Ain't gonna happen though, it's just too assertive for the way I play. I'm already assertive enough (my bandmates say!) on tame basses.
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But the wood must be a factor too
Absolutely. Wood varies in density and vibration transmission, but most most dead spots, especially like those on Jazz Basses have more to do with how that wood is put together than what kind it is. I don't know of any J-Bass copies with 'hog necks, but I have played an old Schecter US made fretless Jazz copy that had a solid rosewood neck and a walnut body, and while it was tonally all together another animal, it played and responded exactly like a 'normal' Jazz.
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I've read somewhere that some extra weight on the headstock helps eliminate dead spots, thats why some people like Sheehan put this weight thingie on their headstocks.
Like the old "FatHead" brass plates they were made to fit on guitar and bass headstocks for years. The newer version is a bolt-on hunk of metal called a Fat Finger. They do make a difference. Satriani uses one. I've read that the plate version on one Fender Bass actually moved the dead spot on his neck around six frets up from the old spot and got it out of the way from the main area of his fretboard.
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:mrgreen: "neckdives like Stuka over Poland"
That dead spot elimination thing always struck me as vodoo acoustics. Any scientific defenders?
I don't have science, but I used to have a Fender with a really bad dead spot, and I put one of the Fat Finger devices on it and it made a huge difference.
That said, my back can't take neck heavy basses any more, so I want a smaller, lighter headstock whenever possible. I've even gone to using a weighted strap on my '76 bird because of the neck dive, so weights on the headstock are out.
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That's enough empirical evidence for my scientific standards, danke. Good to know. I never had a bass with a dead spot so bad I had to do something about it, but now I at least know what can be done.
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That's enough empirical evidence for my scientific standards, danke. Good to know. I never had a bass with a dead spot so bad I had to do something about it, but now I at least know what can be done.
It won't necessarily work. It does work in some cases.
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I don't happen to have any photoshop skills...........
Could anyone do one of a "proper" Anniversery 'Bird so when Gibson trolls us they'll come closer to getting it right :)
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I'd like to see a golden mist Tbird II like this minus the black guard and with a wider saddle section on the bridge to achieve accurate intonation.
(http://i1151.photobucket.com/albums/o632/4stringer77/Joan/TBirdPair_GdBlk3_zps047372de.jpg)
Wonder if the sunset yellow one is a replica. The headstock faces the wrong way.
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No, that's my friend Jon Maye's...It's a real 60's Bird... FREAK of Nature!! But real, nevertheless!!!
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So they stuck a Non Rev headstock on a Rev neck-(thru)? :o :o :o Only with Gibson! :mrgreen:
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That's not an NR headstock, it's a lefty.
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I don't care....It F*&$%^# COOL!
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Did Gibson make lefty T-birds in the '60s?
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I like the way it looks, too.
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The reversed headstock on that yellow Bird does look cool but as I understand the bass has a replaced headstock and the owner had it purposely redone it the configuration it is in now.
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I was thinking about that as an explanation too.
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Gibson made a number of 1964-65 reverse Firebirds with non-reverse headstocks, like that Thunderbird.
I've seen four or five Firebirds like that for sale over the last year alone. I think there are a couple on GBase right now like that. I've heard rumors of 1964/65 TBirds like them out there.
http://s1359.photobucket.com/user/mc2NYNO/media/1964-65Reverve_NonRevHedFB_zps2fa07e2a.jpg.html?sort=3&o=0#/user/mc2NYNO/media/1964-65Reverve_NonRevHedFB_zps2fa07e2a.jpg.html?sort=3&o=0&_suid=136452368747105480388493471493
(http://s1359.photobucket.com/user/mc2NYNO/media/1964-65Reverve_NonRevHedFB_zps2fa07e2a.jpg.html?sort=3&o=0#/user/mc2NYNO/media/1964-65Reverve_NonRevHedFB_zps2fa07e2a.jpg.html?sort=3&o=0&_suid=136452368747105480388493471493)
Some better pics of that Sunset Yellow Reverse/non-rev TBird here:
http://s1359.photobucket.com/user/mc2NYNO/media/Guitars/64TBirdII_SunsetYellowRevNR_zpsc8bce50c.jpg.html#/user/mc2NYNO/media/Guitars/64TBirdII_SunsetYellowRevNR_zpsc8bce50c.jpg.html?&_suid=136455963022205121129842814083 (http://s1359.photobucket.com/user/mc2NYNO/media/Guitars/64TBirdII_SunsetYellowRevNR_zpsc8bce50c.jpg.html#/user/mc2NYNO/media/Guitars/64TBirdII_SunsetYellowRevNR_zpsc8bce50c.jpg.html?&_suid=136455963022205121129842814083)
..or more Tbird pics here:
http://www.snapfish.com/snapfish/shareereg/p=973311364739109551/l=5225145027/g=15090808027/cobrandOid=1000/COBRAND_NAME=snapfish/otsc=SYE/otsi=SAER/pns/snapfish/share/p=973311364739109551/l=5225145027/g=15090808027/cobrandOid=1000/COBRAND_NAME=snapfish/otsc=SYE/otsi=SAER/retusr=true
(http://www.snapfish.com/snapfish/shareereg/p=973311364739109551/l=5225145027/g=15090808027/cobrandOid=1000/COBRAND_NAME=snapfish/otsc=SYE/otsi=SAER/pns/snapfish/share/p=973311364739109551/l=5225145027/g=15090808027/cobrandOid=1000/COBRAND_NAME=snapfish/otsc=SYE/otsi=SAER/retusr=true)
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50th anni. Firebird is up on the Gibson site. Wish they would get up to date on the bass page. The ES 335 bass still isn't up there.
http://www2.gibson.com/Products/Electric-Guitars/Firebird/Gibson-USA/50th-Anniversary-Firebird.aspx
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In case anyone is still interested. Here's the bass on the Gibson site.
http://www2.gibson.com/Products/Electric-Guitars/Bass/Gibson-USA/50th-Anniversary-Thunderbird-Bass.aspx
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Even I find that tone of the gold hardware unfortunate with the fin. My God, they could have done something just a bit more special, couldn't they? It would have given me a reason to get one.
And isn't bullion a French freedom soup anyway?
No mention of walnut content either in the text:
"The core of this exceptional bass lies in its “through neck” construction, with the neck and body core crafted from the same rugged multi-ply mahogany tone wood blank for unparalleled strength and sustain. It takes more work to build a bass this way, but the effort pays off in every aspect of the instrument’s feel and response."
or in the product features:
"•Neck-through Mahogany neck with comfortable, rounded profile".
Might be an oversight, but they have done two-ply maho-only necks on modern TBirds before, eg on the Goth mini series. The very first Revs in 1963 had massive maho mecks too, but I doubt that it was a conscious move by them to recreate just that aspect.
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Fedex has mine now and is set to deliver it tomorrow. Not sure if I'll check a chance to do much with it since this is a holiday weekend here and my significant other has all sorts of things planned but as soon as I get a chance I'll post some detailed pictures.
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It's been a crazy few weeks and I finally got a chance to sit down and take some pics of the bass. I know this seems to be a "love it or hate it" model but I am definitely in the love it category. Looking closely at the back of the neck and headstock I can swear I see a grain change where the walnut stringers would be so I don't know if I believe it's an all mahogany neck but regardless it plays and sounds great.
(http://i1142.photobucket.com/albums/n614/tlkroon/e08794b1-a01e-4ac0-93d1-ba2d54322d20_zps882bc20a.jpg) (http://s1142.photobucket.com/user/tlkroon/media/e08794b1-a01e-4ac0-93d1-ba2d54322d20_zps882bc20a.jpg.html)
(http://i1142.photobucket.com/albums/n614/tlkroon/P1010008_zps0e41c3ce.jpg) (http://s1142.photobucket.com/user/tlkroon/media/P1010008_zps0e41c3ce.jpg.html)
(http://i1142.photobucket.com/albums/n614/tlkroon/7ded5001-e676-4932-9b89-d5a13672a310_zps19ea932f.jpg) (http://s1142.photobucket.com/user/tlkroon/media/7ded5001-e676-4932-9b89-d5a13672a310_zps19ea932f.jpg.html)
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The black pg and pups with the gold is growing on me, not sure about the less than matching (in tone) gold hardware. But anyway, it will become a rarity, looks different and is a TBird, what's to complain?
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Is this a fin too far to miss...?
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It's been a crazy few weeks and I finally got a chance to sit down and take some pics of the bass. I know this seems to be a "love it or hate it" model but I am definitely in the love it category. Looking closely at the back of the neck and headstock I can swear I see a grain change where the walnut stringers would be so I don't know if I believe it's an all mahogany neck but regardless it plays and sounds great.
(http://i1142.photobucket.com/albums/n614/tlkroon/e08794b1-a01e-4ac0-93d1-ba2d54322d20_zps882bc20a.jpg) (http://s1142.photobucket.com/user/tlkroon/media/e08794b1-a01e-4ac0-93d1-ba2d54322d20_zps882bc20a.jpg.html)
(http://i1142.photobucket.com/albums/n614/tlkroon/P1010008_zps0e41c3ce.jpg) (http://s1142.photobucket.com/user/tlkroon/media/P1010008_zps0e41c3ce.jpg.html)
(http://i1142.photobucket.com/albums/n614/tlkroon/7ded5001-e676-4932-9b89-d5a13672a310_zps19ea932f.jpg) (http://s1142.photobucket.com/user/tlkroon/media/7ded5001-e676-4932-9b89-d5a13672a310_zps19ea932f.jpg.html)
Looks A LOT better in your pics :)
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Thanks guys, if you get a chance to see one I really think they look a lot better in person. I tried to capture a the grain in the back of the neck, it's really hard to capture in a photo but it seems like there is a change in the pattern that makes me think it's a standard 5 ply neck. My attempt at a photo:
(http://i1142.photobucket.com/albums/n614/tlkroon/P1010010_zps79e6485c.jpg) (http://s1142.photobucket.com/user/tlkroon/media/P1010010_zps79e6485c.jpg.html)
and it looks better too if you peel the plastic off the pickguard! ;D
(http://i1142.photobucket.com/albums/n614/tlkroon/P1010014_zps80b070af.jpg) (http://s1142.photobucket.com/user/tlkroon/media/P1010014_zps80b070af.jpg.html)
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I don't see obvious signs of a laminate.
The grain of mahogany goes back and forth in stripes. I think that is what you see.
(http://www.tonyscustomcabinets.com/yahoo_site_admin/assets/images/african_mahogany.183143440_large.jpeg)
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It does look better in these latest pics.
Agree with Rob, no obvious sign that it's a laminated neck.
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That looks like one piece - is it a thru-neck...?
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I think it'd be really cool with some gold pup covers and Hipshot clover tuners.......
But it's really growing on me it it's "stock" state :)
I collect for fins ;D
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There are those gold Lollar pups available to give that vintage sound...
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Would you guys please stop making me want something I don't want.
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Would you guys please stop making me want something I don't want.
I do enjoy being a bad influence.........Does HOG actually have one of these Scott?
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Mark they do have one in stock!
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[devil] ooh, you know you need to take a peek, Scott... [/devil]
[angel] don't do it, Scott; it's a reverse... [/angel]
:popcorn:
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It's that pg I don't like so much. The color itself is growing on me.
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You could always remove it and preserve it with the cover-film and sell it for a few hundred dollars on greedbay in a decade or so... :vader:
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True that. I wonder how many Gibson is making (unless someone's already mentioned it)?
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You could always go down the avenue of "I damaged it, would you sell me a replacement?" while it's still current...
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Gibson probably would refuse to sell one.