The Last Bass Outpost
Gear Discussion Forums => Gibson Basses => Topic started by: 4stringer77 on February 09, 2013, 10:52:31 AM
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Got buried in snow here in NH so figured it was a good time to ask around about my EB1's capacitor.
It looks like this outside my window
(http://i1151.photobucket.com/albums/o632/4stringer77/Joan/Brigitte/EB1-snow/IMG_0682_zps60d109c2.jpg)
here's brown Betty
(http://i1151.photobucket.com/albums/o632/4stringer77/Joan/Brigitte/EB1-snow/IMG_0680_zpsb4114339.jpg)
here's the cap
(http://i1151.photobucket.com/albums/o632/4stringer77/Joan/Brigitte/EB1-snow/IMG_0681_zps24ae1c84.jpg)
My query, does the .033 cap look stock? If not is there a better cap for this bass? Thanks, Ari :)
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My bass has a .033 cap also, but it looks older...........
(http://i999.photobucket.com/albums/af119/Grog_03/DSC07482_zps45a24171.jpg)
(http://i999.photobucket.com/albums/af119/Grog_03/DSC07487_zps0ee33e78.jpg)
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We're talking about the 69 reissue, right? I can look at mine tomorrow.
You're not telling me you want to brighten up that thing's sound, are you?!!! Unlike the fifties ones which low mid growlers, the 69 EB RI are "mothers of mud" in the same vein as the EB-0/-3 and EB-2 from that late sixties era are. Subwoof Godzillas!
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We're talking about the 69 reissue, right? I can look at mine tomorrow.
They are both reissues.................... I couldn't help but notice that the capacitors are soldered in differently on these two basses. I don't think they are electrolytic, but they have a bar on one side as if they are polarized. ??? ??? ???
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We're talking about the 69 reissue, right? I can look at mine tomorrow.
You're not telling me you want to brighten up that thing's sound, are you?!!! Unlike the fifties ones which low mid growlers, the 69 EB RI are "mothers of mud" in the same vein as the EB-0/-3 and EB-2 from that late sixties era are. Subwoof Godzillas!
That's a very colorful way to put it: subwoof Godzillas. LOL. Speaking of which, I saw "Godzilla" for the first time on cable recently. Great acting. The (real) French actors on there were very good at making French sound authentic. Also, Godzilla's acting was pretty touching.
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We're talking about the 69 reissue, right? I can look at mine tomorrow.
You're not telling me you want to brighten up that thing's sound, are you?!!! Unlike the fifties ones which low mid growlers, the 69 EB RI are "mothers of mud" in the same vein as the EB-0/-3 and EB-2 from that late sixties era are. Subwoof Godzillas!
It makes sense that they would sound similar as they have similar pickups and wiring.
I have a book of schematics for Gibson basses from the Seventies. It would appear that these EB1s are wired the same as the EBOs with a .033 and .01 cap. The schematic for the EB1 shows a .02 and .01 cap. The .01 cap in both cases is wired in parallel to the pickup and only shows up on these two basses.
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Yes mine is a 69 reissue and I love all it's muddy glory especially when overdriving some tubes. I just figured my cap looked a little too new and must have been replaced at some point. Had a crappy solder connection that needed to be touched up but didn't move anything around. I can see a 68 on one of my pots and the serial number on the back of the headstock is 543151 which dates it 69' I think. Nice one you got there Grog. I'm curious about acquiring a 50's version some day. There's one at Gruhn that's been there forever. Seems like a good player and the $3,500 asking price doesn't seem that unreasonable.
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They are both reissues.................... I couldn't help but notice that the capacitors are soldered in differently on these two basses. I don't think they are electrolytic, but they have a bar on one side as if they are polarized. ??? ??? ???
They ARE electrolytics. The newer one is a Sprague Orange Drop.
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Thanks everyone. To quote Jack Bruce from SWLABR, "such good responses". Incidentally Uwe, the EB3 mudbucker in position 1 has even less treble than the EB1 due to the tone choke, but I'm sure you knew that.
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They ARE electrolytics. The newer one is a Sprague Orange Drop.
Does it matter which way they are wired? which one is correct???
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I pretty much hate people who have Gibson EB-1 basses, although special hatred is reserved for those who have a 50s model in really good condition.
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I pretty much hate people who have Gibson EB-1 basses, although special hatred is reserved for those who have a 50s model in really good condition.
I wanted a 50's model in really good condition, but people in hell want ice water!!! My first EB-1 reissue only cost me $450.00. I should have bought an original at that time before the price skyrocketed...
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I wanted a 50's model in really good condition, but people in hell want ice water!!! My first EB-1 reissue only cost me $450.00. I should have bought an original at that time before the price skyrocketed...
I wish I had bought the one you traded to Willie's. IIRC it was only about $1300 at the time (late 90s).
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I wanted a 50's model in really good condition, but people in hell want ice water!!! My first EB-1 reissue only cost me $450.00. I should have bought an original at that time before the price skyrocketed...
This is what it's like to live a tortured existence. The agony of it all.
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I wish I had bought the one you traded to Willie's. IIRC it was only about $1300 at the time (late 90s).
I never did see what he sold it for. I think he was asking $1350.00 for the one I have now, it was a consignment from a gal whose husband had passed away if I recall correctly.
Nate has a 1965 EB-2 for sale for $3,000.00......................ouch!! I paid $230.00 for my '67 used in 1974! Must be getting old!!
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Does it matter which way they are wired? which one is correct???
The caps look like they're wired the same to me. What do you think is different?
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does a cap in parallel with the pickup do anything useful for your tone?
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I never did see what he sold it for. I think he was asking $1350.00 for the one I have now, it was a consignment from a gal whose husband had passed away if I recall correctly.
Nate has a 1965 EB-2 for sale for $3,000.00......................ouch!! I paid $230.00 for my '67 used in 1974! Must be getting old!!
I think he had it listed at about the same price as the one you traded for. No idea what it finally sold for.
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Does it matter which way they are wired? which one is correct???
In terms of capacitance, "correct" is in the ear of the beholder. Changing the capacitance value will change the corner frequency of the passive filter formed by the cap to ground. The larger the capacitance value, the more bassy the tone knob acts. In terms of polarity, if it's hooked up wrong, you won't get any sound, so that's an easy check.
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does a cap in parallel with the pickup do anything useful for your tone?
A cap in parallel will still filter highs, but not in a useful (IOW, not much at all) way and will mess with the taper of the volume pot.
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The caps look like they're wired the same to me. What do you think is different?
I don't see a dif either and mi RI is wired that way too, the cap looks bownish faded as in Grog's pic, yours, Ari, looks indeed newer and highly likely that it is, but if something old doesn't work anymore then it needs to be replaced, right? That is taking care of your instrument. I never gave a rat's ass even on my most prized vintage instruments whether the caps and pots are still original. I prefer a scratch-free new pot to a scratchy original one.
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That's a very colorful way to put it: subwoof Godzillas. LOL. Speaking of which, I saw "Godzilla" for the first time on cable recently. Great acting. The (real) French actors on there were very good at making French sound authentic. Also, Godzilla's acting was pretty touching.
You saw the Emmerich remake, right? :mrgreen: Horrible, I read your irony. My countryman is responsible for some really crap films though his most recent one about Shakespeare is a most welcome departure from the catastrophy/sci fi//monster fodder he has churned out and well worth a view even you think Emmerich is horrible otherwise (like I do).
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3PUMP4YBCEM
The only thing good about Emmerich's Godzilla was the animation of the monster itself (the old Japanese Godzilla was always a bit like an extra from the mupper show), all slithery and fast (the hobby zoologist in me says that it was perhaps a bit too amphibian for a reptile, amphibians and reptiles aren't that close at all, reptilians and birds are much closer), but it had no heart and failed to engender any empathy for the ravaged nature/creature, something the old Japanese Godzilla as an allegory for Hirshima/Nagasaki and man's destruction of earth always did. Even the Alien monster has at least motherly love for its breed. Emmerich totally failed to get that. Goes to show that not all gay men automatically have empathy. And Jean Reno, much as I like the guy, must have been counting the money all the way to the bank while he was "acting" in this piece of junk. I had high hopes for this movie when it came out that it would at least be a decent B-movie like Independence Day, but it failed abysmally to even be a tolerable B-movie.
There is one more exception in his regularly less than passable oeuvre and that is the 13th Floor which flopped in 1999 but wasn't a bad movie at all and in its logic certainly superior to the muddled Inception I had to wade through a year ago.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xsl0-ON7P8A
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It makes sense that they would sound similar as they have similar pickups and wiring.
I have a book of schematics for Gibson basses from the Seventies. It would appear that these EB1s are wired the same as the EBOs with a .033 and .01 cap. The schematic for the EB1 shows a .02 and .01 cap. The .01 cap in both cases is wired in parallel to the pickup and only shows up on these two basses.
You mean your EB1 schematic has an .02 cap in place of the .033?
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There must have been a change in actual production then. It is highly unlikely that all three of our EB-1s had the original cap replaced by the same 033 cap. My bass certainly looks totally unhampered with. Not that I would know what the difference between the two caps would actually be soundwise.
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The EB-1 schematic on Gibson's site also has an .02 instead of an .033. It says it's a 9/5/75 redrawing, which was well after the model was discontinued. I agree with Uwe, no way three of them would all have had a factory .020 then later replaced with an .033. Either there was a production change or there never was a production version with the .02.
http://images.gibson.com/Lifestyle/Support/Files/Schematics/EB1.PDF
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You saw the Emmerich remake, right? :mrgreen: Horrible, I read your irony. My countryman is responsible for some really crap films though his most recent one about Shakespeare is a most welcome departure from the catastrophy/sci fi//monster fodder he has churned out and well worth a view even you think Emmerich is horrible otherwise (like I do).
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3PUMP4YBCEM
The only thing good about Emmerich's Godzilla was the animation of the monster itself (the old Japanese Godzilla was always a bit like an extra from the mupper show), all slithery and fast (the hobby zoologist in me says that it was perhaps a bit too amphibian for a reptile, amphibians and reptiles aren't that close at all, reptilians and birds are much closer), but it had no heart and failed to engender any empathy for the ravaged nature/creature, something the old Japanese Godzilla as an allegory for Hirshima/Nagasaki and man's destruction of earth always did. Even the Alien monster has at least motherly love for its breed. Emmerich totally failed to get that. Goes to show that not all gay men automatically have empathy. And Jean Reno, much as I like the guy, must have been counting the money all the way to the bank while he was "acting" in this piece of junk. I had high hopes for this movie when it came out that it would at least be a decent B-movie like Independence Day, but it failed abysmally to even be a tolerable B-movie.
There is one more exception in his regularly less than passable oeuvre and that is the 13th Floor which flopped in 1999 but wasn't a bad movie at all and in its logic certainly superior to the muddled Inception I had to wade through a year ago.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xsl0-ON7P8A
I'm talking about the Emmerich movie which I only saw last year on cable. I did consider watching when it came to the theaters, but didn't. I had a childhood friend (who later became a successful nature and wildlife artist) who got me kind of interested in that genre. I was always more interested in sci-fi and he was more interested in horror. So, it's possible I might actually like "The 13th Floor." I did notice the animation in Godzilla was very good, though. I have to agree on that. Of course, I was also hoping for a lot more in the movie.
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I suspect the original EB1 had the .02 cap but when reissued they just used the same parts as they used on the EB0.
My book of schematics are all dated early to mid Seventies, and only one of the redraws has the original date and that is from '66 for the EB2-D. They are copies of these:
http://www.gibson.com/Files/schematics/EB1.PDF
http://www.gibson.com/Files/schematics/EB0.PDF
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Also, on the picture that the pot values are visible it shows both pots are 500k, conforming to the EB-0 schematic
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... So, it's possible I might actually like "The 13th Floor."
Well worth a visit - I've had a DVD of this one for years now - some clever twists...
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Well worth a visit - I've had a DVD of this one for years now - some clever twists...
I'd definitely be curious to see it.
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Well worth a visit - I've had a DVD of this one for years now - some clever twists...
I remember liking that one. Vincent D'Onofrio stars, as I recall. I may be in the minority of one who loved Independence Day. I think Emmerich captured the spirit of the old '50s sci-fi films without taking it so far into the effects that the story got lost. It was high-tech cheese all the way. Emmerich was also executive producer of The Patriot.
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its hard to imagine that .01 capacitor across the pickup doing anything helpful to the tone.has anyone tried it without?
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its hard to imagine that .01 capacitor across the pickup doing anything helpful to the tone.has anyone tried it without?
You could check this video, he uses a .01 in one of the settings. Ofcourse its a different pickup, with much less windings than the Mudmeister, but you could get an idea.
Generally, I think that pickups with lesser windings are more "sensitive" to different capacitor values.
edit: forgot the link, where's my mind?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3I62Xfhts9k
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The caps look like they're wired the same to me. What do you think is different?
There is a bar inked on one side of the cap identifying polarity, yours is wired opposite of mine.
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I remember liking that one. Vincent D'Onofrio stars, as I recall. I may be in the minority of one who loved Independence Day. I think Emmerich captured the spirit of the old '50s sci-fi films without taking it so far into the effects that the story got lost. It was high-tech cheese all the way. Emmerich was also executive producer of The Patriot.
Independence Day was a good popcorn munching movie. See it be, be entertained and forget it.
The issue with The Patriot was that Emmerich had the Brit troops act like the Waffen SS in the East in that movie - there is however no historic evidence for British troops behaving like that in the Independence War. At least the English think so!
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The Patriot was a crappy movie. Totally hated it. The only people I was around who liked it were females.
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There is a bar inked on one side of the cap identifying polarity, yours is wired opposite of mine.
I see what you mean now Grog. I think Psycho Bass Guy said earlier that if the polarity is wired incorrectly, the bass won't produce any sound. My bass produces plenty of sound so I'm not sure what effect my cap with the reverse installed painted stripe has if any. Please don't get an aneurysm thinking about it too hard. Maybe someone else with greater knowledge can offer us an explaination.
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He also said that the cap is an electrolytic, they are generally polarity sensitive. (is that a real term?) It may not make any difference in this application. If it works it's gotta be right, I was just curious..............
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I hear ya. I think it's odd as well. Maybe my cap is bi-polar ;D
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Nuts...
Gary mentioned ID which I've watched several times; also 2012 and Day After Tomorrow... I looked up his IMDB list and had forgotten that he was responsible for Stargate too, which I also consider to be a great movie...
Talking movies and spin-off's...
buysoylentgreen (http://www.buysoylentgreen.com/)
Horse burgers are making the news here too...
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He also said that the cap is an electrolytic, they are generally polarity sensitive. (is that a real term?) It may not make any difference in this application. If it works it's gotta be right, I was just curious..............
From a little research:
Generally film capacitors are not polarized, but some have a marking on one lead. Many caps have/had a marking indicating the side of the cap that'd best be connected to the most low-Z point of the circuit.
In the tone control of a guitar it wouldn't make any difference.
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From a little research:
Generally film capacitors are not polarized, but some have a marking on one lead. Many caps have/had a marking indicating the side of the cap that'd best be connected to the most low-Z point of the circuit.
In the tone control of a guitar it wouldn't make any difference.
Thanks! 8)
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To give the little pecker bass some credit: As usual inspired by this thread, I had my RI EB-1 with me today at the rehearsal, together with a Stingray (mag/piezio), the Grabber II, the Lee Sklar (I know I have derided that bass in the past, I have now strung it with Ernie Ball Cobalt Slinkies and wow!, it has brought nice midrange on that active EMG driven bass like it never had before). Anyway, three (or two and half if you don't count in the passive Grabber II) modern basses with treble and the works, but when I dug out the EB-1 threateningly for the last few songs (among them our cover of The Cranberries chestnut "Zombie"), man, what a primal, lustful, archaic and one of a kind experience it was once again!!!! Bemuddled I was! All hail thee, lil' EBee!!! No bass has a voice like you.
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Just came back from an open mike and brought my EB1 as well. Used it for everything from Tom Petty to Sublime and Stevie Wonder and everybody was digging the sound through a GK 400rb no less! The amp was the house bassist's and I let him play the EB1 also. He didn't want to put it down and kept jamming while his jazz bass sat in the corner.
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It's a force of nature. The compactness and thickness of its violin body and the mud bludgeoning out of it make it one hell of a combination.
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^
A force of nature. A term that Jack Bruce used to describe Jimi Hendrix. Also applicable to the EB-1, but for different reasons, of course.
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It's a force of nature. The compactness and thickness of its violin body and the mud bludgeoning out of it make it one hell of a combination.
The thickness sure has something to do with it. I wonder if it's also possible that the long body and the bridge location well away from the end of the body contribute to the different sound (from an EB-0).
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It's the Stradivarius of Gibson electric basses. That thick block of Honduras Mahogany with a Mudbucker strapped to it gives it balls to be reckond with! Too bad there are only 473 to go around! (Reissues that is). I wonder how many have actually survived over 40 years of Rock & Roll........... ???
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While it wasn't a Gibson, I really did love this bass when I had it. It was one of my projects that turned out nicely. It's one that I'd buy back, if I knew where it was.
(http://i19.photobucket.com/albums/b170/gweimer/basses/EB1_3.jpg)
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Personally, I really like the way a T-Bird and an EB-1 look. The EB-0 and EB-3--not so much.
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While it wasn't a Gibson, I really did love this bass when I had it. It was one of my projects that turned out nicely. It's one that I'd buy back, if I knew where it was.
(http://i19.photobucket.com/albums/b170/gweimer/basses/EB1_3.jpg)
I'm happy with mine!!! "God-Saw of Thunder" got it for me from the HOG. It's a really nice fretless to play, E string ain't exactly mighty with its medium (not short) scale and the pup is a bit tame, but I've left everything (including the immaculate 3 point bridge, mein Herr, you will be punished for your careless sins, no doubt!) as is, it fits together as a combo. Whenever I play it, I think "Macca would have probably liked this". Of course it has nothing to do with how real EBs sound, with its balsa ??? wood body or whatever, but it has a resonant little voice of its own.
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Personally, I really like the way a T-Bird and an EB-1 look. The EB-0 and EB-3--not so much.
The SG shape is not exactly a bassy look, especially in its original flimsy strength. I do like the phattened up 70ies models better.
That said, Frankfurt Musik Messe is approaching fast and I hope to employ new found contacts for my unfulfilled Tower of Babylon project, the Doubleneck SG Bass with fretless longscale and short scale fretted with D and G octaved. I'll learn the intro of STH for it too!!! My last count was (about) 110 Gibson basses (not counting Epis, Orvilles and Kalamazooomphs) - does no one have a friggin heart in Nashville?
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The SG shape is not exactly a bassy look, especially in its original flimsy strength. I do like the phattened up 70ies models better.
That said, Frankfurt Musik Messe is approaching fast and I hope to employ new found contacts for my unfulfilled Tower of Babylon project, the Doubleneck SG Bass with fretless longscale and short scale fretted with D and G octaved. I'll learn the intro of STH for it too!!! My last count was (about) 110 Gibson basses (not counting Epis, Orvilles and Kalamazooomphs) - does no one have a friggin heart in Nashville?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rdWppXeL1cY
Dedicated to those in Nashville who need to have a heart.
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Of course, his has mods, but it's obvious Jack Bruce does have a fondness for his EB-1. Besides using it for half the reunion concerts, probably a lesser known fact is that he featured it on one of the segments on his instructional video.
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What mods other than real tuners and the Schaller Königstiger Behemoth bridge? His is a fifties model, but he has stuck with the singlecoil. I believe he started using it with Ringo, when he wanted a bass that looked "Beatlish", yet still felt somehow familiar in sound.
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What mods other than real tuners and the Schaller Königstiger Behemoth bridge? His is a fifties model, but he has stuck with the singlecoil. I believe he started using it with Ringo, when he wanted a bass that looked "Beatlish", yet felt somehow familiar in sound.
I have no idea where the article is where I read about the mods. I just remember it was slightly more extensive than I was expecting. Also, it does appear that there had been some confusion over exactly what had been done. So, some speculation was being used by whoever was discussing this. I knew, of course, that he had played with Ringo's band, but I didn't realize that's when he started using the EB-1. It makes sense, though, to have used it under those conditions.
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Maybe the Pappalardi mod? I have a Felix pre-owned fifties EB-1 (not his No 1, that gathers French Fries grease in Toronto's Hard Rock Café), refinned cherry while he was still alive, and it has a notched tone pot (I heard he did that on all his EBs) which starting from the middle position attempts to change the original singlecoil sound to humbucker mud mania. Not quite there, but it tries hard.
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Maybe the Pappalardi mod? I have a Felix pre-owned fifties EB-1 (not his No 1, that gathers French Fries grease in Toronto's Hard Rock Café), refinned cherry while he was still alive, and it has a notched tone pot (I heard he did that on all his EBs) which starting from the middle position attempts to change the original singlecoil sound to humbucker mud mania. Not quite there, but it tries hard.
I could be mistaken, but I think I remember reading something Aussie Mark made about Jack's EB-1 on another board. He is the one who needs to be asked about this most likely. Please page Aussie Mark over the intercom.