The Last Bass Outpost
Gear Discussion Forums => Bill's Shop: Projects, Mods & Repairs => Topic started by: neepheid on February 11, 2011, 03:21:47 AM
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During a drunken conversation at the Moffat Bass Bash, I proposed a solution to the neckdive of the Thunderbird bass - make it headless. I remember it being a visionary idea at the time, but in the cold, sober light of day it seems like a daft project to take on for a laugh :)
This may be the talk of a dead heretic walking here but I would like to butcher a bolt on Thunderbird (Epiphone Goth preferred because of mahogany body) and add a headless neck and bridge. I might alter the body shape a little to address another of what I see as one of the faults of the Thunderbird - high fret access.
I've been pottering around in the GIMP and come up with this:
(http://www.ifb.co.uk/~matthew/pics/headless_tbird/mockup1.jpg)
Possible moving of the lower horn to allow improved high fret access:
(http://www.ifb.co.uk/~matthew/pics/headless_tbird/mockup2.jpg)
I think I've managed to source a donor headless so all I need now is a loaded t-bird body, or a t-bird with a broken neck. As I said above, I would prefer an Epiphone Goth for the donor body. Has anyone got anything lying around?
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Actually, I don't think it's too crazy considering the commonality of headless TBs. My avatar is a clear example! I think it would be an intriguing project. Besides, used Epi TBs aren't that expensive and I'd want an unmolested one so I could cut the headstock off myself.
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I had to laugh very hard about the headless T-bird logo ;D
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I commented on this a while back...
You can pick up a Hohner Jack (resplendant with a through neck - Precision D profile - double octave), cut the edges off and have "wings" fitted - probably wouldn't be that hard a project...
[welcome - Lowlander (sasenach) or Highlander (teuchter)? ;) - lots of pepper with the neeps ;D]
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Welcome!
I have to say that a headless Tbird just doesn't work for me.
On the other hand the headless logo is just perfect - this I love! ;D
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While the project is interesting the Thunderbirds reputation for neck dive is overblown. To me this looks like fixing a problem that doesn't exist.
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The donor headless turned out to be a bit of a loss, but I've had some good fortune lately - a friend has given me some headless hardware, and I've managed to win a donor Epiphone Goth T-bird on eBay for < £100 - had a lifting bridge which the previous owner had tried to fix by A) packing the post holes with an unknown substance/material and B) tried to fit a regular Fender style bridge, leaving screwholes. This is the perfect donor bass for me - I'm going to obliterate the one issue that it has.
In keeping with the delicious 80s feel of the headless, I think I'll refinish the body/neck in white with a black "headless T-bird" pickguard.
godofthunder: I'm not suggesting that it's an endemic problem to all T-birds, and I apologise if I didn't make myself clear. It helps to remember that this idea stemmed from a drunken conversation ;)
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If nothing else you will have created the bar gig proof Tbird ;D
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Very useful for gigs with low headroom...
I consider my Hohner to be a bit of a chisel... ;D
Oh yeah... usual rules apply...
:popcorn:
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A quick update, I've filled all the spurious holes in the body which were left by various bridges and the neck.
(http://www.ifb.co.uk/~matthew/pics/headless_tbird/20110307/01_top_all.jpg)
(http://www.ifb.co.uk/~matthew/pics/headless_tbird/20110307/02_back_all.jpg)
(http://www.ifb.co.uk/~matthew/pics/headless_tbird/20110307/03_back_heel.jpg)
(http://www.ifb.co.uk/~matthew/pics/headless_tbird/20110307/04_top_bridge.jpg)
(http://www.ifb.co.uk/~matthew/pics/headless_tbird/20110307/05_top_pocket.jpg)
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Whoah... what on earth happened to that neck pocket - that's some termite hole... ;D
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Whoah... what on earth happened to that neck pocket - that's some termite hole... ;D
It was a rather rough hole about 10mm in diameter which was probably used to hang the body while it was being sprayed. It's covered by the neck plate normally. Unfortunately, I only had 6mm and 22mm mahogany dowel so I had to enlarge it a bit first ;)
You can see the original problem here:
(http://www.ifb.co.uk/~matthew/pics/headless_tbird/20110228/bodynbridge.jpg)
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I'd be tempted to strip that down and get it anodised in black - will it need to inset...? my own idea when I thought it through would have been to cut away a section of the body to allow access to the tuners...
What is that one from...?
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I'd be tempted to strip that down and get it anodised in black - will it need to inset...? my own idea when I thought it through would have been to cut away a section of the body to allow access to the tuners...
What is that one from...?
I should be able to obtain a black unit at a later date, but a mate gave me the unit for nothing so I'll use it for now. It does require a recess. I will recess further back if needs be rather than cutting away a section of the body as I want to retain the Thunderbird shape.
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I've started to think about the dusty end access (especially as I've secured a 21 fret neck) and came up with this:
(http://www.ifb.co.uk/~matthew/pics/headless_tbird/20110310/proposed_cutout.jpg)
I realise this shape change will be heresy to some, but I think it's fairly subtle. All I'm doing is continuing a line a bit further then ending in a tighter turn where it meets the neck pocket. What do you think?
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After making the bird headless there's not much more you could do that's worse...seriously, why not? it will make it easier to play. Looking good.
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CHopping up TBs is not really sacrilage around here! Right Scott????
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Should I keep out of this one...? ;D
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Should I keep out of this one...? ;D
Opps, I forgot Kenny's contributions too!
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With our cousin here that makes it SAW III... ;D
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With our cousin here that makes it SAW III... ;D
The more the merrier!
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CHopping up TBs is not really sacrilage around here! Right Scott????
As long as I live I'll never live it down! ;D
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There are now THREE Butcher Brothers! ;D
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An (un) Holy Trinity... :vader: :vader: :vader:
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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mSCYmV3_r6k
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Hmmm, some private jokes being passed around here ;)
I think I've scored a neck so while I wait for it to arrive I've been removing the finish from the body. The black stuff isn't too bad but there's a sealer coat underneath that is proving a lot tougher to shift.
(http://www.ifb.co.uk/~matthew/pics/headless_tbird/20110313/01_whirr_swoosh.jpg)
(http://www.ifb.co.uk/~matthew/pics/headless_tbird/20110313/02_front.jpg)
(http://www.ifb.co.uk/~matthew/pics/headless_tbird/20110313/03_back.jpg)
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Nothing private about thes jokes... ;D
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Sorry for the lack of updates, I ran out of steam and there was stuff round the house to do (put up shelves, fit an extra front door lock because our neighbours keep dubious company, blinds to put up).
Anyway, I've got my second wind, so here we go :)
I got to work on attaching the neck to the body. Having never made a neck pocket in my life before (this neck is so different from the old one it's like making a new one) I was nervous about this. I was reading this very useful article which gave me the impetus to get off my backside:
http://buildyourguitar.com/resources/pocket/index.htm
However, I'm not quite ready to go straight to the body, so instead I made a template out of MDF marked with a centre line so I can place it on the (similarly marked) body. Using the same trick of clamping two lengths of wood to the sides of the neck then removing the neck I got this (with a router with a roller at the top of the cutter):
(http://www.ifb.co.uk/~matthew/pics/headless_tbird/20110801/01_template.jpg)
Applying this to a spare bit of MDF yielded this:
(http://www.ifb.co.uk/~matthew/pics/headless_tbird/20110801/03_pocket.jpg)
Which unfortunately was "70s Fender" tight ;)
(http://www.ifb.co.uk/~matthew/pics/headless_tbird/20110801/04_gap.jpg)
No worries though, I have a trick for this eventuality. I will apply an appropriate number of layers of electrical tape to the guide roller, pulling the cutter away from the template edge and making the hole a little smaller.
In other news I have decided to get some high end headless hardware to do a right good job of this project. I have gone with ABM stuff.
(http://www.ifb.co.uk/~matthew/pics/headless_tbird/abm_bridge.jpg) (http://www.ifb.co.uk/~matthew/pics/headless_tbird/abm_headpiece.jpg)
Eventually, I hope it's going to end up something like this:
(http://www.ifb.co.uk/~matthew/pics/headless_tbird/mockup_abm.jpg)
(http://www.ifb.co.uk/~matthew/pics/headless_tbird/mockup_rear.jpg)
Except that the pickguard will be black.
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I had to laugh very hard about the headless T-bird logo ;D
+1 ;D
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Progress report:
Neck is now definitely headless :)
(http://www.ifb.co.uk/~matthew/pics/headless_tbird/20110806/01_off_with_his_head.jpg)
(http://www.ifb.co.uk/~matthew/pics/headless_tbird/20110806/03_top.jpg)
(http://www.ifb.co.uk/~matthew/pics/headless_tbird/20110806/04_top_back.jpg)
(http://www.ifb.co.uk/~matthew/pics/headless_tbird/20110806/02_front.jpg)
New neck pocket routed out (a little tight, but better that than too loose)
(http://www.ifb.co.uk/~matthew/pics/headless_tbird/20110807/01_all.jpg)
(http://www.ifb.co.uk/~matthew/pics/headless_tbird/20110807/02_angle.jpg)
(http://www.ifb.co.uk/~matthew/pics/headless_tbird/20110807/03_closeup.jpg)
I am now stalled at the point of deciding what to do about dusty end access. As it stands all I've added is one even more difficult to get to fret onto a Thunderbird. I can't decide where to put the neck screws until I've worked this out.
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the irony of this project is perfect. :)
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Nice job!
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Are you going to scallop the tail a bit so you can turn the tuners easier?
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Are you going to scallop the tail a bit so you can turn the tuners easier?
Once I get them fitted I'll see if it's necessary and yes, I'll do that if I feel it will be beneficial.
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I built a headless based on the Steinberger several years back . I would have prefered the tuning bridges you are using.Much more suttle. I hope they are easier to tune than mine.
Very nice job.
(http://i34.photobucket.com/albums/d138/shadowcastaz/meisterberger.jpg)
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While I completely despise headless basses you are making a good go of this! I had my doubts.
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the irony of this project is perfect. :)
Ain't that da truth !
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Well, I've decided to stop messing about worrying about modifying the body shape and just get the damn thing assembled. I've got 2 weeks off coming up and a set of double ball end strings just arrived in the post. There are three (relatively) simple steps:
1. Get the neck properly attached (will use a neck plate for now, but will be using recessed bushings eventually)
2. Get the bridge units attached (checking that the positioning is feasible for both intonation adjustment range and attaching double ball end strings)
3. Rewire electronics
After that I'll be able to assess the playability and make proper decisions about any body modifications (lower cutaway edge bevelling, scalloped out end for easier access to the tuners, possibly moving the strap button from the upper bout to the neck heel somewhere).
I'm looking forward to having a go on it soon :)
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While I completely despise headless basses...
One of the few areas we differ on... ;)
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Apologies for zombie thread awakening.....
Just getting parts together for one of these here.
Donor neck & tuners? Check
TB body? Check.....uncheck....
Got a sunburst Epi with case for VERY cheap to use as a patient but when wifey said "That one is very pretty" while we were cleaning it and setting it up on her kitchen island(bass workbench), I decided it's a beater/keeper and will get a body somewhere else.
The headless TB here will most likely be white, chrome hardware, and 2 Greco TB pups donated from their 3 pickup Les Paul clones with fretsonthenet rings. Chromitis has no cure I'm afraid.
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Bump! Did this savagery ever get completed? I've been toying with the idea of sawing up my Tokai Thunderbird in the same manner.
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It didn't get completed yet partly due to time(not enough) and these projects ahead(no pun intended) of it:
1) Pot pickups on Greco V bass(or replace with chrome clone ones)
2) Texas flag bass(cheap SG clone) to partly copy "Little Texas" bassist's custom bass
3) Installation of more than a few T-Bird copy pickups into basses that are here
Plan pic of Texas Flag copy bass except the one here will have painted(Cheap Trick method) pickups to blend in with the flag. It's currently painted and awaiting time to put back together, hand-paint/touchup bridge area(it's in the star and will have the star painted over it), road test. The cheapo was $199 IIRC and worked OK in its stock form at a gig prior to the mods being started.
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I've finally decided to weigh in on this:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xoMgnJDXd3k&ab_channel=FunAvenue
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a-fraAN7in4
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I've finally decided to weigh in on this:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xoMgnJDXd3k&ab_channel=FunAvenue
Oh god I wish we had "like" buttons. :mrgreen: