The Last Bass Outpost
Main Forums => The Bass Zone => Topic started by: Dave W on March 28, 2019, 06:52:05 PM
-
Two new videos linked in the article. Her voice is a lot lower now, not surprising since she's 68.
No Control: An Interview with Suzi Quatro (https://www.notreble.com/buzz/2019/03/28/no-control-an-interview-with-suzi-quatro/)
-
Her advice for up and coming bassists is good.
-
She's on record about never feeling comfortable with how she had to pitch her voice on those early RAK/Mickie Most/Chinn-Chapman hits, she felt it sounded samey and lacked expression. As early as the later 70ies she tried to escape that.
No one would mistake Suzi for Aretha Franklin, but when she doesn't have to squeal, she has a real nice tone - to me:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5IDT3QPgB6U
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=91MuR2wYtzA
I'm actually gonna see her on that coming tour.
-
I enjoyed her comments, especially about failed guitarists playing the bass. ;)
-
I enjoyed her comments, especially about failed guitarists playing the bass. ;)
Yep. Sloppiness can be a virtue on guitar. I've seen and heard too many guitarists try to transfer that attitude to bass. It never works well.
-
Yep. Sloppiness can be a virtue on guitar. I've seen and heard too many guitarists try to transfer that attitude to bass. It never works well.
I've even known *really good* guitarists whose timing and/or phrasing sounds terrible on bass.
Even if they can credibly double the bass part on guitar.
There's something non-obvious that just doesn't always translate across the instruments, it takes some dedication to actually be able to play both well.
-
I've even known *really good* guitarists whose timing and/or phrasing sounds terrible on bass.
Even if they can credibly double the bass part on guitar.
There's something non-obvious that just doesn't always translate across the instruments, it takes some dedication to actually be able to play both well.
Your use of the word "translate" makes me think of the example of Spanish and Portuguese. Just because you're fluent in one doesn't make you fluent in the other. There are countless nuances that have to be mastered. The same goes for guitar and bass. Little things add up and become big things.
-
So true. IMO, if you can't feel the rhythm as a guitarist you'd better stay away from the bass guitar.
-
Yep. Sloppiness can be a virtue on guitar. I've seen and heard too many guitarists try to transfer that attitude to bass. It never works well.
Who me, mate?
(https://i.guim.co.uk/img/media/641684260c7c626c4aa0e1c23414b9b7ea844ca4/0_49_3678_2207/master/3678.jpg?width=620&quality=45&auto=format&fit=max&dpr=2&s=29ec4ec94f626d748ae413ea14416389)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fD_6KqP7K0g
Note: Ronnie Wood, not Lane played the bass on that track (Lane just aped it on TV) - in all its ultra-sloppy grandeur.
There is an exception to every rule.
-
Who me, mate?
(https://i.guim.co.uk/img/media/641684260c7c626c4aa0e1c23414b9b7ea844ca4/0_49_3678_2207/master/3678.jpg?width=620&quality=45&auto=format&fit=max&dpr=2&s=29ec4ec94f626d748ae413ea14416389)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fD_6KqP7K0g
Note: Ronnie Wood, not Lane played the bass on that track (Lane just aped it on TV) - in all its ultra-sloppy grandeur.
There is an exception to every rule.
Ah, this explains much, I really never liked the bass on that song - sorry Ron.
-
Ah, this explains much, I really never liked the bass on that song - sorry Ron.
Likewise. Sloppy, overplayed, crappy tone.
-
You two will go to Faces hell. They are heating up for you as I write. :mrgreen:
The way the bass line ambles and stumbles through the song - with quite a few melodic highlights - sounds just perfect to me. Yes, sometimes sloppy can be perfect. ;D
-
You two will go to Faces hell. They are heating up for you as I write. :mrgreen:
The way the bass line ambles and stumbles through the song - with quite a few melodic highlights - sounds just perfect to me. Yes, sometimes sloppy can be perfect. ;D
Like Jimmy Blackmore? :-*
-
There is an exception to every rule.
Amen. All Woody all the time guitar/bass on Rod's first solo records as well as (bass, mostly) on first two Jeff beck Group albums.
https://youtu.be/GmyGa29zIqk
-
I'm Team Uwe this time. I love Woody and Plonk, together and apart.
It does surprise me that a pünktliches, gründliches German - especially a lawyer - loves sloppiness.
-
I'm Team Uwe this time. I love Woody and Plonk, together and apart.
It does surprise me that a pünktliches, gründliches German - especially a lawyer - loves sloppiness.
Yeah but he HAS been to Memphis.
-
I've even been IN Elvis' house! Which is not the huge mansion you might believe it to be. Any self-respecting investment banker would want something larger.
"Like Jimmy Blackmore?"
:mrgreen:
If I think real hard about it, I'm probably Dave's nemesis on this: I think accuracy is more important with a guitarist than a bassist, mainly because you hear the former's mistakes more! :mrgreen: Page's solos to me are all over the place, some good ideas, some noodling, some background noise & some quite a few mistakes. :) His solos are more landscapes within the overall Zep sound - not virtuoso outings as with Blackmore. When Blackmore played a solo with Purple, you listened up - regardless of the melée going on behind it.
When it comes to chordal structures, alternative tunings etc though, Page can run circles around Blackmore who was happy to thump his E string if that was all it took.
-
Gene Simmons calls Ron Wood his favorite bassist (stemming back from the Jeff Beck Group work), so there!
And Hard Luck Woman always tried to ape the Maggie May bass line - more accurately played of course!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GUFuJQATLZA
But why did Peter Criss continuously bob and twitch his head like an extra from the Muppet Show while singing?
A+ for Ace's and Paul's idiosyncratic understanding of what a doubleneck-guitar is for. At 2:50, Indian deity Shiva, no less, plays four-handed guitar(s) for Kiss, who'd have thought. :mrgreen:
-
Gene Simmons calls Ron Wood his favorite bassist (stemming back from the Jeff Beck Group work), so there!
....
If my contrary opinion hadn't already been formed years ago, Gene's opinion would have solidified it. :mrgreen:
-
And Hard Luck Woman always tried to ape the Maggie May bass line
Not just the bass line! Rod should have sued them.
But why did Peter Criss continuously bob and twitch his head like an extra from the Muppet Show?
Isn't that what cats do? ;D
-
A+ for Ace's and Paul's idiosyncratic understanding of what a doubleneck-guitar is for. At 2:50, Indian deity Shiva, no less, plays four-handed guitar(s) for Kiss, who'd have thought. :mrgreen:
What the hell is that? Shouldn't they have each had 12strings and girls of their own to do that with instead of each other? :gay:
As much as I love Gene's bass playing, Ron's is on another level. Sloppy or not at least it's melodic where Gene pretty much just gives you meat and potatoes. Maggie was a huge hit and still on the radio in part to Mr. Wood's contribution on bass. I am a huge fan of his other work with Beck too. I'd pay through the nose to see a show with Ronnie on bass again backing up Jeff and Rod.
-
This bass line for example is fantastic. Perhaps a tad sloppy but wonderfully quirky and intricate in it's melodiousness as well.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oiCWhOzk18U
-
A+ for Ace's and Paul's idiosyncratic understanding of what a doubleneck-guitar is for. At 2:50, Indian deity Shiva, no less, plays four-handed guitar(s) for Kiss, who'd have thought. :mrgreen:
Haha! I remember seeing that when I was 13 and thinking "Um... is that really necessary?" :gay: ;D
Peter was always my favorite singer in KISS. Usually chewing gum (and bopping his head) as he does.
-
I've even been IN Elvis' house! Which is not the huge mansion you might believe it to be. Any self-respecting investment banker would want something larger.
"Like Jimmy Blackmore?"
:mrgreen:
If I think real hard about it, I'm probably Dave's nemesis on this: I think accuracy is more important with a guitarist than a bassist, mainly because you hear the former's mistakes more! :mrgreen: Page's solos to me are all over the place, some good ideas, some noodling, some background noise & some quite a few mistakes. :) His solos are more landscapes within the overall Zep sound - not virtuoso outings as with Blackmore. When Blackmore played a solo with Purple, you listened up - regardless of the melée going on behind it.
When it comes to chordal structures, alternative tunings etc though, Page can run circles around Blackmore who was happy to thump his E string if that was all it took.
Page = Interesting, I like him as a rhythm player much better than as a soloist.
Blackmore, Really like him as a soloist, a style all his own, as a rhythm player he's good, not great - still interesting in style.
-
I like a lot of sloppy guitarists.
I think Page's lead ideas are often quite interesting, and his sloppy execution doesn't bother me.
He's certainly nothing like, say, Jeff Beck, who of the big-name classic English players is so smoothly executed it seems to have sprung wholly formed out of his instrument almost like it's an angelic voice with no clunky human hands involved. A great player no doubt, but very, very different.
I also love the playing of D. Boon, an adventurous wild man on the guitar.
His life tragically ended in a van crash at age 27, and thus ended the Minutemen with him.
He was one of those over-eager young players who often played at (or slightly beyond) his physical limitations. He definitely went overboard at times, though most Minutemen songs were so short you didn't have time to get tired of the guitar solo before it was over :D
He didn't make it sound easy, rather he made it sound like he could barely keep up with what he wanted to play, but it was a distinctive voice and I love it, warts and all. I wish he had had a chance to mellow with age, but I'm glad we got what we did of him.
-
I can like sloppy guitarists too, if it suits the music - like Angus Young or maybe Mick Ronson, they might loose a note or two in combat but they fight on and win the war anyway.
Some sloppiness, like sloppy stoned or sloppy don't really know how to play the guitar - like Neil Young, is not my cup of tea.
-
How did we get here? Mark and I said we didn't like the bass on Maggie May. Did either of us say we hated every bit of Ron Wood's work? No, nothing of the sort. Trying to beat us over the head with his other work is pointless. You can post 50 more videos and it won't change my opinion of Maggie May. Please stop.
I still agree with Suzi's advice.
-
Are we trying to return to topic here, Dave?
(https://media0.giphy.com/media/KjmU8PBS4Dv68/giphy.gif)
Not after all these years please.
Besides, we were discussing Blackmore too, so it was actually very much on topic as far as I am concerned.
(https://i1.wp.com/68.media.tumblr.com/aedb601ac3ee231dcfe82744f1ed2b2e/tumblr_oo39yaMU8v1r9tvl8o1_1280.gif?w=605)
-
Haha! I remember seeing that when I was 13 and thinking "Um... is that really necessary?" :gay: ;D
Starchild always toyed a little with a more exotic lifestyle image - careful to not unsettle the core audience too much though.
Peter was always my favorite singer in KISS. Usually chewing gum (and bopping his head) as he does.
He was probably the best natural singer with Kiss - Gene and Ace don't really have voices to write home about and Paul's vocal affectations are often just too much cherry (lips) pie for me.
The Catman was possible the most un-hard-rock and certainly un-heavy-metal drummer on earth, but his Ringo Starr/Charlie Watts drumming sure know had something ... That hi-hat hit at 0:31/32 is - for lack of better words - sheer bloody art. :rimshot:
-
Not just the bass line! Rod should have sued them.
Herr Eisen (who wrote the song) even offered it to him. Considering some of the stuff Roddie released in the netherworld of the late seventies and throughout the 80ies, he was ill-advised not to take it. This was Rod's nadir I thought:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TUdEp3ZP9tc
This was horrible too ...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ofA3URC1wyk
Amazing that Sting's, Adams' and Stewart's worst piece of work is one and the same song. Crap movie too.
-
Are we trying to return to topic here, Dave?
No, just pointing out that we didn't need to hear about everything else Ron Wood has ever done in some misguided effort to make us change our minds about one song.
-
Well, it could have always gotten even worse if the dreaded "Mick Taylor was better for the Stones than Ron Wood"-follow up discussion would have reared its ugly head!
BTW, Mick T was a more accurate bass player too as can be heard here (Wyman wasn't at the session for that particular song). You can tell it's Mick because he follows Charlie's bass drum more closely than Bill W ever did. :mrgreen: As if he had thought to himself "I've heard that in other bands, the bassist locks in with the bass drum, perhaps we should try that for once ...".
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6U8JlcB_BzA
Not knocking Bill though, he was idiosyncratically great, just not much of a bass drum follower, but not everyone has to be.
-
Herr Eisen (who wrote the song) even offered it to him. Considering some of the stuff Roddie released in the netherworld of the late seventies and throughout the 80ies, he was ill-advised not to take it.
Why on earth would Rod record a second rate version of his own song? Wouldn't make sense to me.
Amazing that Sting's, Adams' and Stewart's worst piece of work is one and the same song. Crap movie too.
Agreed that it's crap. But I'm pretty sure the bank account of the three don't mind one bit about that...
-
Not knocking Bill though, he was idiosyncratically great, just not much of a bass drum follower, but not everyone has to be.
Everybody knows that each Rolling Stone has been ordered to follow Keef, except Keef. :mrgreen:
-
Well, it could have always gotten even worse if the dreaded "Mick Taylor was better for the Stones than Ron Wood"-follow up discussion would have reared its ugly head!
BTW, Mick T was a more accurate bass player too as can be heard here (Wyman wasn't at the session for that particular song). You can tell it's Mick because he follows Charlie's bass drum more closely than Bill W ever did. :mrgreen: As if he had thought to himself "I've heard that in other bands, the bassist locks in with the bass drum, perhaps we should try that for once ...".
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6U8JlcB_BzA
Not knocking Bill though, he was idiosyncratically great, just not much of a bass drum follower, but not everyone has to be.
Guilty of being a bass drum follower. But if I could have an idiosyncratic style like Bill Wyman, I wouldn't mind that, either. I think his unique style added yet another twist to the Rolling Stones sound. Of course I mostly prefer their earlier stuff and haven't really listened to them much in a very, very long time.
-
The Stones without Wyman are a Stones cover band.
-
The Stones without Wyman are a Stones cover band.
You are quite right, that's what they sounded like when I saw them in '95. Who was it, Darryl Jones? Anyway, it was a good bass player but the show in sum was generic.
-
Darryl Jones is a skilled bass player, but he wouldn't play any different if he was with Journey.
I think the explanation why a lot of 60ies bass players like McCartney, Wyman, Bruce or Entwistle did not follow the bass drum much was simple: You really didn't hear it back then either live or on recordings. I only heard the bass drum on Purple's 60ies recordings when I heard their music on CD for the first time (not vinyl) and was genuinely surprised: "There's a bass drum pattern here?!"
Bass and bass drum slavishly locking into one another really only came to my attention via disco music in the mid to late seventies.
And the fact that the traditional role of bass in jazz for decades had not been to follow the drums, but to lay a walking bass foundation to which complex bass drum patterns were added on top was in my view also a reason why 60ies bassist played the way they played.
-
The Stones without Wyman are a Stones cover band.
I'm not saying the replacement members aren't good. But I wouldn't want to see the Stones without Bill Wyman or Flleetwood Mac without Lindsey Buckingham. You couldn't give me the tickets for free.
-
Cherie Currie on Suzi Quatro's RRHOF snub.
https://www.yahoo.com/entertainment/rock-n-roll-motivators-cherie-currie-and-brie-darling-talk-new-album-rock-halls-suzi-quatro-snub-181122190.html
-
I don't see it happening. RRHOF is US-centric, and she never had much success here. Her only Top 40 single in the US was her duet with Chris Norman, and I doubt that would have happened without her TV success on Happy Days.
As for Cherie Currie not respecting the RRHOF, that's a pretty big club already.
-
I'd say the RRHOF became a big joke a while ago. It may have some relevance, but not really all that much. Putting people in who should be out and keeping people out who should be in.
-
Putting people in who should be out and keeping people out who should be in.
So it's like the white house, but for musicians? :-X
-
So it's like the white house, but for musicians? :-X
You sound like my best friend who is saying stuff like that all the time. But what I really should have emphasized is that the worst part is deserving people who have been left out. It's true there are some that shouldn't be in there at all, but that's a lesser problem, IMO. This is a long list and not everyone on it should be in, but some definitely should be.
https://www.cleveland.com/entertainment/2018/12/rock_roll_hall_of_fames_50_mos.html
-
You sound like my best friend who is saying stuff like that all the time. But what I really should have emphasized is that the worst part is deserving people who have been left out. It's true there are some that shouldn't be in there at all, but that's a lesser problem, IMO. This is a long list and not everyone on it should be in, but some definitely should be.
https://www.cleveland.com/entertainment/2018/12/rock_roll_hall_of_fames_50_mos.html
Delighted to see Dick Dale on that list!!
I just had a shadow box made up with stuff Dick signed. Sam Bolle also signed the guitar strap. Can't get the picture to show.
-
If the RRHOF is screwed up, that list is just as bad. About a third of those artists aren't rock 'n' roll at all. Jazz, reggae, country, soul, hip hop... NOT rock.
-
If the RRHOF is screwed up, that list is just as bad. About a third of those artists aren't rock 'n' roll at all. Jazz, reggae, country, soul, hip hop... NOT rock.
I found all the lists to be flawed, including that one. But it did have a few artists that I really think need to be on there. If the RRHOF could just put in a few that really belong like the Doobie Brothers, that would be very helpful. How they are not already in the RRHOF, I really have no idea. The Doobie Brothers are essential.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HP_NE4XZGAc
-
Sure, there are artists on that list who should be included. OTOH there's Captain Beefheart, who belongs on a list of pretentious pseudo avant garde twaddle.
-
Sure, there are artists on that list who should be included. OTOH there's Captain Beefheart, who belongs on a list of pretentious pseudo avant garde twaddle.
What? Not a fan of Captain Beefheart's rock and roll masterpiece "Bat Chain Puller?' I've never paid any attention to Captain Beefheart or quite a few others on that list, either. I was just providing the list as an example. If I made up my own list, it would be way different than that one, although I suspect my list would also have some flaws in it.
-
"...a list of pretentious pseudo avant garde twaddle."
Are you channeling Spiro Agnew? ;D
Agnew, speaking to the California Republican state convention on September 11, 1970: “In the United States today, we have more than our share of the nattering nabobs of negativism. They have formed their own 4-H Club — the ‘hopeless, hysterical hypochondriacs of history.'”
-
Are you channeling Spiro Agnew? ;D
Agnew, speaking to the California Republican state convention on September 11, 1970: “In the United States today, we have more than our share of the nattering nabobs of negativism. They have formed their own 4-H Club — the ‘hopeless, hysterical hypochondriacs of history.'”
Agnew was quite a fan of alliteration. What gets me is that he looked so much like my high school biology teacher it was uncanny.
-
Are you channeling Spiro Agnew? ;D
Agnew, speaking to the California Republican state convention on September 11, 1970: “In the United States today, we have more than our share of the nattering nabobs of negativism. They have formed their own 4-H Club — the ‘hopeless, hysterical hypochondriacs of history.'”
Agnew was quite a fan of alliteration. What gets me is that he looked so much like my high school biology teacher it was uncanny.
Spiro's alliterations were all written by William Safire. Spiro wasn't bright enough to have written his own speeches.
-
Then I guess it was also Safire who came up with his "pussillanimous pussyfooting" line which is really quite a weird thing to say in any context.
-
Then I guess it was also Safire who came up with his "pussillanimous pussyfooting" line which is really quite a weird thing to say in any context.
Yes indeed. I disliked many of his views but the man had a way with words.
-
Yes indeed. I disliked many of his views but the man had a way with words.
I think we can now look back and safely say he was way more skilled with language than politics. This is a common problem for intellectuals to think their expertise can transfer from one field to another. But I think I remember reading some of his columns on language in my local newspaper long ago.
-
https://www.loudersound.com/news/watch-trailer-for-new-suzi-quatro-documentary?fbclid=IwAR3EnGkiGkcNOVwgkvOwV6YjcX77ahq7l0viXYz_2-bzXrHC7WRx0AVXNLM
-
https://www.loudersound.com/news/watch-trailer-for-new-suzi-quatro-documentary?fbclid=IwAR3EnGkiGkcNOVwgkvOwV6YjcX77ahq7l0viXYz_2-bzXrHC7WRx0AVXNLM
It should be a success in the UK, and I wish her the best. Not sure about this:
Firmager says: “There is only one Suzi Quatro. She has sold 55 million records and still fills stadiums around the world. She was so influential but has yet to be recognised for her contribution to music.
“This film is an attempt to readdress that and introduce her to a new generation.”
Hard to do that when most of the stars being interviewed are from the old generation.
-
I found all the lists to be flawed, including that one. But it did have a few artists that I really think need to be on there. If the RRHOF could just put in a few that really belong like the Doobie Brothers, that would be very helpful. How they are not already in the RRHOF, I really have no idea. The Doobie Brothers are essential.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HP_NE4XZGAc
Totally with you, the Doobies epitomize in so many ways what's unique with US music, they have a breadth of work that encompasses blues, folk, hard rock, white soul, jazzy Steely Dan "yacht rock", country, you name it.
-
Totally with you, the Doobies epitomize in so many ways what's unique with US music, they have a breadth of work that encompasses blues, folk, hard rock, white soul, jazzy Steely Dan "yacht rock", country, you name it.
Through the years I've had a tendency to lean more toward British rock. But American rock at times can match it or even surpass it.