The Last Bass Outpost
Gear Discussion Forums => Bill's Shop: Projects, Mods & Repairs => Topic started by: drbassman on April 10, 2008, 02:39:36 PM
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It will get one of those nice maple necks I got from greatdealz and I'm even thinking about using the 2 Gibson Melody Maker pup covers as well. Maybe add a second pup to it.
Anyway, it'll probably end up about 50% Gibson when all finished. Is that close enough for our forum here?
(http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y16/drbassman/Vox%20HB/voxtop.jpg)
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Ever since one of our most honorable members recreated "Saw IV" with a newly acquired innocent, alas! Even virgin white TB and then badassed to add insult to injury, this forum has bared itself of all inhibitions regarding impurity of Gibson products ... So please fire away Herr Doktor!
Uwe
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I think it has a lot of "Gibson" potential!
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Is this a new project, or one of your ongoing ones I missed? I don't remember seeing that body before.
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Very nice, I can't wait to see it grow.
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You know, if you keep posting stuff like this, I may have to contract you to do something for me. That's some mighty fine work you post. 8)
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Is this a new project, or one of your ongoing ones I missed? I don't remember seeing that body before.
I just snagged it today. A whopping $88. The Epi Sheraton is coming along, I had to take it to my luthier for some reverse engineering on the raw neck I had. I just couldn't get it right. I need to work with chisels and hand tools more!
This one will be bolt on and a bit easier for my budding skills. I haven't decided whether it will be 30 or 34" scale. We'll see after I have some time to play with it.
I'll be posting some pics of projects as they finish up within the next week or so. Getting close on the 98 LP.
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You know, if you keep posting stuff like this, I may have to contract you to do something for me. That's some mighty fine work you post. 8)
Well, I don't quite yet have the kahonies to mess with stuff for other folks, but that's my ultimate retirement goal! Right now it takes me weeks to do what should only take days or hours. Being self taught can be torture, but it sure is fun once you learn something.
The challenge on this one will be adding maple to the heel of the old raw Gibson maple neck to turn it into a bolt on as it's currently a set-neck. That shouldn't be too much of a challenge. I've done some similar things already. I'm also thinking of leaving the finish alone and just wet sanding out the flaws and abuse so it keeps its vintage vibe. Sometimes, jumping into a refin isn't always necessary.
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Did you scratch your name in the top near the bridge area, claiming it yours?
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Did you scratch your name in the top near the bridge area, claiming it yours?
Nope, not Me. the PO did it and I'm going to sand/fill it out if I can. I'd like to preserve the old finish if possible.
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Mucho mojo!!!!!Goooo redsox!!!!!!
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Mucho mojo!!!!!Goooo redsox!!!!!!
Maybe there's a t-shirt buried in it!! :D LOL
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Ever since one of our most honorable members recreated "Saw IV" with a newly acquired innocent, alas! Even virgin white TB and then badassed to add insult to injury, this forum has bared itself of all inhibitions regarding impurity of Gibson products ... So please fire away Herr Doktor!
Uwe
I believe I heard my name being called ! Yes my Tbird was virgin, I savored very cut of the blade. (http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v102/godofthunder59/IMG_1135scottjs.jpg)
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Ah Scott, the "butcher!" :D
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I like to think of myself as liberator. ;D Just think of those those poor shackled upper register notes now free because of my skilled hands. Call me Butcher if you must I will wear it proudly.
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"I like to think of myself as liberator. Just think of those those poor shackled upper register notes now free because of my skilled hands."
;D :D :) ;D :D :)
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Sweeney Todd musical is coming to Chicago, there still might be a spot open Scott?
Do you craft meat pies as well?
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(http://www.soylent-network.com/doku/bilder3/JA01A_RGB_300dpi.jpg)
:D
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Naturally, I didn't mean butcher in a pejorative sense. I was thinking more like an "artistic" hacker, like me! ;)
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Scott you are a visionary. When I get the money together I am going to trim up the fat on my t-bird as well! I have two songs recently where I have to use those highest frets and it's a bear right now.
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Scott you are a visionary. When I get the money together I am going to trim up the fat on my t-bird as well! I have two songs recently where I have to use those highest frets and it's a bear right now.
Ever heard of the theory how a lot of the murders attributed to Jack the Ripper might have actually been committed by people emulating him? I see that compulsive mechanism at work here ... ::)
:D :D :D
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Just get a replica non reverse or the studio Tbird, due to the greater radius on the body it gives better upper fret access.
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Scott you are a visionary. When I get the money together I am going to trim up the fat on my t-bird as well! I have two songs recently where I have to use those highest frets and it's a bear right now.
Imitation is the sincerest form of flattery. ;D
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Unless you are a Gibson attorney
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Just how did I lose control of this topic???? :o
The body still hasn't come in yet. The seller didn't ship it out from Californication until a week after the auction ended!
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Just how did I lose control of this topic???? :o
The body still hasn't come in yet. The seller didn't ship it out from Californication until a week after the auction ended!
Lose control ? This is the Gibson forum after all.
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Lose control ? This is the Gibson forum after all.
I forgot, no rules here! :o
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OK, here's the pup I'm gonna use in this Vox HB. It's a 1/4 lb. SD for Jaguars. It fits right into the Gibson Melody Maker pup cover. It'll need just a little bit of sanding on the top cover so it fits without pushing the edges of the cover outward. Very cool, like a super Music Master!!!
(http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y16/drbassman/Vox%20HB/100_1393.jpg)
(http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y16/drbassman/Vox%20HB/100_1395.jpg)
(http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y16/drbassman/Vox%20HB/100_1396.jpg)
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Very cool !
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Very cool !
I think so too!
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I got covers,does this mean I dont have to wait for melody maker pups to roll back my sb400? I take it the 6 poles have little affect on 4 strings of a bass?
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I got covers,does this mean I dont have to wait for melody maker pups to roll back my sb400? I take it the 6 poles have little affect on 4 strings of a bass?
Well, Fender used 6-pole Stratocaster pups in all of their Music Master basses, they never used a bass pup in them. They sounded pretty good for what they were! I would say you don't have to wait for Melody Maker pups if you want ti try the SD Jags. String spacing shouldn't be a problem with these huge magnets SD uses in the model I bought. It never seemed to hurt the Music Masters I've had in the past!
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Also, the Rickenbacker toaster has six alnico poles and works fine on bass.
Pickups where the polepieces are the magnets seem to work despite the misalignment. You might have a problem if you used Gibson PAF style construction, with small diameter plain steel polepieces and the magnets underneath the bobbin.
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Also, the Rickenbacker toaster has six alnico poles and works fine on bass.
Pickups where the polepieces are the magnets seem to work despite the misalignment. You might have a problem if you used Gibson PAF style construction, with small diameter plain steel polepieces and the magnets underneath the bobbin.
Good points Dave. I think this will work out fine.
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Got the Vox body finally. It's just as it was pictured. Abused but not broken. I'm filling the scratches in the poly with super glue, should work just fine. I'm trying to save its vintage appearance. Stripping poly is the worst!
I got the pup all done and fitted into the cover. Just had to file the top cover about 2mm or so and it slides right in now....
(http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y16/drbassman/Vox%20HB/100_1397.jpg)
(http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y16/drbassman/Vox%20HB/100_1402.jpg)
(http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y16/drbassman/Vox%20HB/100_1400.jpg)
(http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y16/drbassman/Vox%20HB/100_1401.jpg)
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Ooh. I hope it sounds as good as it looks in that cover and ring combo.
I'm not sure what kind of finish Vox used, but I do remember it was glopped on extra thick, at least on the Italian ones made by Pigini (EKO) . So thick that finish cracks were common.
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You are correct. This one is thick poly, just like a Fender! A few cracks here and there, but CA will take care of them.
I think (hope) the pup sounds good. It should, after all, it's a beefy SD!
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I'm loving this old Vox. It's a true HB, no sound block up the middle, just braces. Light as a feather! I'm using CA glue to fill in the scratches and nicks and it's working well. The dufus who had it before scratched the name "Burning Flame" on it in 3 places. What a rocket scientist he must have been! Very creative too. Show me a flame that doesn't burn!
Anyway, here's the scratches filled with CA...
(http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y16/drbassman/Vox%20HB/100_1406.jpg)
And here it is sanded flat. You can also use a razorblade scraper to take it down before sanding....
(http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y16/drbassman/Vox%20HB/100_1408.jpg)
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looking nice. We all learned a new trick.
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uuuuuuuuuuuuuuh,CA ,crazy glue?
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Super glue, crazy glue, whatever you like to call it!
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Talk about puttin' out a fire! That came out really good. I've used clear lacquer (Deft, etc..) to touch up, cut, and buff chips and scratches on basses w/ lacquer finish. Can you use CA on those too? or is this just a trick reserved for poly?
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Talk about puttin' out a fire! That came out really good. I've used clear lacquer (Deft, etc..) to touch up, cut, and buff chips and scratches on basses w/ lacquer finish. Can you use CA on those too? or is this just a trick reserved for poly?
You can use CA for very small nicks on nitro and other lacquers, but you have to be careful, it really melts it and can get into the color below and mess it up. I pretty much reserve the CA for poly finishes which it's really compatible with. It just melts right into poly and any nick or scratch is filled with no visible lines after sanding. Really works great!
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Well, I wet sanded until my elbow ached, threw some polish on the body and rats........still some deeper scratches visible from sanding, not form the original abuse. Man I hate wet sanding! Back to the sanding routine tonight!
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Wet sanding is finished. All of the deep ugly scratches are gone. there are some vintage nicks and flaws, but I want this bass to look its age when finished. Next, fitting and finishing the mahogany
neck.
(http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y16/drbassman/Vox%20HB/100_1473.jpg)
(http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y16/drbassman/Vox%20HB/100_1474.jpg)
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Noice,bloody noice!mate.
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Will be starting on a similar project with a Japanese Vox copy
Need to find a neck though
http://www.pbase.com/rvl/image/97534779 (http://www.pbase.com/rvl/image/97534779)
Thanks
Robert VanLane
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Thanks shadow! I'm really pleased with how it turned out. After stripping a couple poly finishes in the past, I'm in favor of saving them now when I can and this bass just screams 60s!!!!!
Robert, that's a nice looking body there and those fake Hofner pups are kinda cool looking too. You'll have to keep us up on how it goes!
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The neck is just about ready for gluing the fretboard on. I found a really cool old Teisco bridge, modeled after the Gretsch roller bridge, and it's gonna work nicely on this bass.
(http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y16/drbassman/Vox%20HB/100_1486.jpg)
(http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y16/drbassman/Vox%20HB/100_1487.jpg)
(http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y16/drbassman/Vox%20HB/100_1488.jpg)
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another great job, dr!
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This is really taking shape nicely. I hope you'll be able to intonate okay with that bridge, or at least get close enough.
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This is really taking shape nicely. I hope you'll be able to intonate okay with that bridge, or at least get close enough.
Intonation? I don't need no stinking intonation! :toast: I'll just twist the treble end upwards and we'll be doing fine!
This is the same bridge as the one of my Gretsch Thunderjet and it intonates fine with a twist!
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another great job, dr!
Thanks ramone! I want your maple Gibson with the tort guard for my collection!
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thanks, dr b, that's the nicest thing anyone's ever said to me! ;)
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hey Doc,what are you gonna do for a headstock?
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thanks, dr b, that's the nicest thing anyone's ever said to me! ;)
You're welcome!
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hey Doc,what are you gonna do for a headstock?
Something like the new Vox guitars. I just don't care for the canoe paddle headstocks.
(http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y16/drbassman/Vox%20HB/voxhead.jpg)
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I ordered these for tuners. Very retro looking!
(http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y16/drbassman/Vox%20HB/TK_7855-010_large.jpg)
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I found a really cool old Teisco bridge, modeled after the Gretsch roller bridge
IIRC the Gretsch bridge was called Space Control. You can easily adjust string spacing which is cool, but it's straight, not following the neck radius.
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The system of the bridge of my '64 Burns seems to work the same as the bridge pictures above. One proble. If you are putting on and tuning new strings, the 'saddles' ofcourse move sideways over the screw thread, and the string spacing changes:) In the end I have four strings with three different spacings between them ;D Very irritating. I have to roll the saddles a bit to the side and hope they don't move to much by the sliding string.
My English is okay, but not if I have to explain some technical things. Hope you understand it.
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The system of the bridge of my '64 Burns seems to work the same as the bridge pictures above. One proble. If you are putting on and tuning new strings, the 'saddles' ofcourse move sideways over the screw thread, and the string spacing changes:) In the end I have four strings with three different spacings between them ;D Very irritating. I have to roll the saddles a bit to the side and hope they don't move to much by the sliding string.
Not a problem with the ol' Gretsch... First of all I never change strings ;) and even if I did, 44 years of corrosion ensure that it takes more than just changing strings to move those ring saddles sideways.
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The system of the bridge of my '64 Burns seems to work the same as the bridge pictures above. One proble. If you are putting on and tuning new strings, the 'saddles' ofcourse move sideways over the screw thread, and the string spacing changes:) In the end I have four strings with three different spacings between them ;D Very irritating. I have to roll the saddles a bit to the side and hope they don't move to much by the sliding string.
My English is okay, but not if I have to explain some technical things. Hope you understand it.
superglue!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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To be honest, I know I should hold each saddle with one hand while tightening the strings with the other. It's an interesting dilemma, but not insurmountable!
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The neck is almost finished. It's all contoured and sanded, ready for grain filling and fret board gluing. This one should be done within a few weeks!
(http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y16/drbassman/Vox%20HB/100_1509.jpg)
This is my version of a Vox headstock. It will have a Gibson-style black face. I was thinking of using the boat paddle form, but I thought this was more tasteful!
(http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y16/drbassman/Vox%20HB/100_1510.jpg)
Got the neck angle all set with the bridge in place, we're ready to roll!
(http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y16/drbassman/Vox%20HB/100_1511.jpg)
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You may have just saved me a LOT of trouble!
The vintage Lyle HB I've been putting off working on has one or two pretty deep scratches across the front lower bout area. I've been dreading trying to polish down enough to eliminate them. I'm reasonably sure that this 70's Matsumoku product has a poly finish, and if so, then the CA glue you used in your scratch repair earlier in this thread might be my savior.
This pic doesn't show the scratches, just the bass (a 335-copy, of course...):
(http://i83.photobucket.com/albums/j306/apowell1/Electric%20Basses/Lyleonstand.jpg)
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Very cool looking. It has a Harmony H-style bass look to it. CA should work just fine. You can use it on old nitro too if you're careful. Not likely that any of the old Japanese basses were nitro however. They tended to use poly for its ease of application and filling qualities.
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I'm grain filling the neck for the Vox right now. Hope to have it done in a week or so. The pup is almost ready too.
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Cool - I keep checking back for progress.
BTW - after the CA scratch-fill, what was your sanding paper sequence? Start about 800 grit and work up to 2000, then polish?
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Cool - I keep checking back for progress.
BTW - after the CA scratch-fill, what was your sanding paper sequence? Start about 800 grit and work up to 2000, then polish?
I started (you're not going to believe this) with a random orbital sander and 320 grit only in the areas where I filled and there were tons of them on this one. The poly was so thick it didn't make a dent in it! I don't recommend this intial step for the faint of heart! Afterward, I did the usual progression from 800 up through 1500. Perfect It II and Finesse and I was finished.
Your Lyle body is pretty darn close to my Vox. In fact, I was looking at a Framus on eBay and it looks alot like that one except for the control hole locations.
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Random orbital sander and 320 grit??
No kidding, not for the faint of heart!!!!!
Dang, sounds like luthier work by Tim Taylor, featuring MORE POWER!!!
I suspect there are many similarities between hollowbodies from that era. I am pretty sure that Univox, Aria, Lyle and Epiphone all would have the same or nearly the same dimensions, since they were all built in the same factory. Since most were copying Gibson, it would make sense that they would head the same direction. However, that wouldn't make parts interchangeable.
I'll try to get a better photo of that Lyle - I'm sure you would enjoy seeing it.
And to ask a detail technique question, when you mention using a razor blade scraper, do you point the blade toward the direction of travel, or drag the blade behind your hand (tip facing back) as you scrape?
I figure it doesn't hurt to ask the guy who has BTDT with such great results.
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Yeah, I get kinda crazy sometimes with so many irons in the fire. I did forget the scraping step before the sander. I take a razor blade (this is hard to visualize, but I'll try to describe it), lay it flat on my bench with just the sharp edge hanging over by 1/16" or so. I take a round screwdriver shaft, hold it at a 45 degree angle toward the bench and, while using moderate downward pressure, drag it over the sharp edge from one end to another. This curls the edge of the blade downward, creating a burr. Then, you take the blade and drag it toward yourself as a scraper. The burr catches whatever sticks up above the surface and cuts it off.
It works great and you should practice on some wood scrapes first. It also makes a great binding and small wood repair/glue scraper as well. Make sense?
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I was going to mention how to make a scraper but you beat me to it. :P One thing that I'd recommend is slightly bending the blade so the ends don't come into contact with the instrument.
This isn't a big deal with an arched instrument, but on a slab body you can end up with some extra scrapes when the CA close to flush.
I'm enjoying this project as it progresses. I've been on the lookout for a decent box to turn into a bass for a while now.
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Good point on the ends treatment. That's why I try mine out on a scrape before I use it on a finished body.
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That was an excellent description - I have a clear picture of how to do it. The suggestion about curling the ends up is a great one - no need to take a chance on making more gouges. And practicing first is a GREAT idea.
Muchas gracias. :mrgreen:
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My pleasure!
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Here's my very first inlay attempt. I just did a rough rout, glued them in and filled with black CA glue I got from LMII. It's great stuff, it dries a nice solid black color and fills really well. This is the second application, which should be all I need. I'll sand it back tomorrow. Then, the neck is ready for finishing!
I've also taken to using black ebony veneers on my headstocks, much nicer looking that black painted headstocks IMO.
(http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y16/drbassman/Vox%20HB/100_1945.jpg)
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Inlay almost finished. Next, some S&S!
(http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y16/drbassman/Vox%20HB/voxinlay.jpg)
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That's cool!!!!
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Thanks Chris, I'm slowly getting the hang of this inlay thing. Takes a lot of patience and practice and the right Dremel!!!
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Wow :o That came out fantastic!
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Nice!!! I agree on the ebony topping. less plastic the better. IMHO :mrgreen:
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Yeah, the ebony is so nice and natural. I'm also experimenting with the black fiber board, which Gibson also use for some basses. It's very easy to work with too and give the same effect without any grain. It's what you see around the pic of the Gibson inlay above.
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Inlay all finished. We'll do the fret board next!
(http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y16/drbassman/Vox%20HB/100_1986.jpg)
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I wanted this neck to look 40 years old, so I rough sanded it after filling, left a few scratches and marks on it. I also applied a red mahogany stain directly to the wood and let it sit and darken a few spots more than others. I then shot it with S&S and amber tint for age it a bit. It really turned out nice and vinatge looking IMHO.
(http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y16/drbassman/Vox%20HB/100_2032.jpg)
(http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y16/drbassman/Vox%20HB/100_2031.jpg)
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I got my Vox reissue pickup from Phantom and it's gonna be a nice look and it should sound pretty good too, it's a humbucker. Also got the Vox aluminum knobs for that authentic look. I'll be sanding/polishing the neck in about 2 weeks and we'll put her altogether then!
(http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y16/drbassman/Vox%20HB/100_2047.jpg)
(http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y16/drbassman/Vox%20HB/100_2048.jpg)
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I'm speechless Bill ! looks fantastic :o
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Yeah, I'm getting psyched about it. Can't wait for that nitro on the neck to dry. I got a pickguard question for you, check your PM.
I also found out this body is from a Vox Tornado and I don't think they made a Tornado bass, but what the heck!
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Is that finish waiting to be rubbed out?
Vox often had several model names for the same body with slightly different features. Could be a Tornado, could have been a guitar, could just as well have been a bass model with that body style. Whatever. You're making it a bass, and that's that.
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Is that finish waiting to be rubbed out?
Vox often had several model names for the same body with slightly different features. Could be a Tornado, could have been a guitar, could just as well have been a bass model with that body style. Whatever. You're making it a bass, and that's that.
It's been polished already and it reflects everything in sight! I didn't obsess over it and left a few little flaws here and there in honor of its age. Won't be long now.......
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I wasn't pointing out flaws (or even looking for them), it's just that the lighting or the camera makes it look somewhere in between matte and gloss.
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Now that there's a pickup sitting in there, I see that it's really close to the end of the neck. Interesting placement.
Brings up thoughts of discussions about pickup placement on the Telecaster bass - is it better at the end of the neck, or a few inches closer to the bridge? I'll bet it sounds great either way.
NICE lookin' pickup, too!
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I wasn't pointing out flaws (or even looking for them), it's just that the lighting or the camera makes it look somewhere in between matte and gloss.
I didn't take it as a criticism. I just thought you were curious! It is half way between matte & gloss! I filled all of the scratches and then while I was wet sanding I decided to not go nuts and polish the old poly to a minor like finish. I just wanted a relic look without it looking trashed. I think it turned nice, but worn looking.
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Now that there's a pickup sitting in there, I see that it's really close to the end of the neck. Interesting placement.
Brings up thoughts of discussions about pickup placement on the Telecaster bass - is it better at the end of the neck, or a few inches closer to the bridge? I'll bet it sounds great either way.
NICE lookin' pickup, too!
Yeah, ain't it cool!? It's perfect for this bass. I'm glad one of the guys suggested I contact phantom. It's working out really well!
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Here she is all wired up............
(http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y16/drbassman/Vox%20HB/100_2051.jpg)
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Got the neck mounted temporarily, just waiting for some longer screws for it. Once I get the screws, she'll be strung up and ready to test drive!
(http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y16/drbassman/Vox%20HB/100_2061-1.jpg)
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Quite Cool!
And I see elsewhere that you've got the matching six-string for your Birthday.
Many Regards,
Scott ( BassVI )
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Quite Cool!
And I see elsewhere that you've got the matching six-string for your Birthday.
Many Regards,
Scott ( BassVI )
Yeah, I can't wait to get it.
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OK, all finished except some final fret dressing. I had a sand thru on the headstock (rats!!!), so I'll reshoot some clear coat in the spring. Winter's here to stay! The Phantom Vox-clone humbucker is great! What a nice pup, I'd definitely use them again. She sounds so good, I can't believe the tone out of this little patch-together project. The Rotosound Jazz Flats are a perfect match for this hollow body with a humbucker.
(http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y16/drbassman/Vox%20HB/100_2097.jpg)
(http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y16/drbassman/Vox%20HB/100_2098.jpg)