The Last Bass Outpost

Gear Discussion Forums => Gibson Basses => Topic started by: uwe on February 22, 2011, 11:58:19 AM

Title: 1987 pre-regular line Custom Shop TB IV
Post by: uwe on February 22, 2011, 11:58:19 AM
http://cgi.ebay.com/Gibson-Thunderbird-Bass-1987-Custom-Shop-/260738242009?pt=Guitar&hash=item3cb535d5d9

Still has the jack on the top and the headstock might actually still be a large one, hard to tell from those pics, but it certainly has large open gear tuners. But for a pre-regular series model the price he asks isn't outrageous. Whether this thing sounds better or even different than the regular Reissue Birds that came out later is anybody's guess though. I hadn't been aware that in 1987 they did a Cusrom Shop "test run" before reinstating the TBird as a regular model but it makes sense. Auction over in a few minutes, if no one snipes at it it will no doubt be relisted  ...

Or should I give it a try?  :-\
Title: Re: 1987 pre-regular line Custom Shop TB IV
Post by: uwe on February 22, 2011, 12:07:17 PM
I just did ... 1.666 Dollars, so if anybody here wants it more than I ... feel invited. Destiny at work.
Title: Re: 1987 pre-regular line Custom Shop TB IV
Post by: TBird1958 on February 22, 2011, 12:15:29 PM


 Yeeech.......Black Hipshot!   He wrecked it.
Title: Re: 1987 pre-regular line Custom Shop TB IV
Post by: uwe on February 22, 2011, 12:19:47 PM
Calm down, Mark, the original bridge is still there.

George Carlston, where are you? You have a TBird foster child waiting for you. Seller won't ship to ze Reich and given how you have experience in trying out pre regular-line Birds for me I want this sent to you for a lengthy stay and a fastidious report here before it makes its way over the Atlantic.
Title: Re: 1987 pre-regular line Custom Shop TB IV
Post by: uwe on February 22, 2011, 12:21:58 PM
I hasten to add: This was not collecting for fins!!! (And in any case my 97 TB IV has the same fin.) It's a Custom Shop model, that is entirely different.  :-[
Title: Re: 1987 pre-regular line Custom Shop TB IV
Post by: Dave W on February 22, 2011, 12:22:15 PM
Another one for Uwe's collection. I think that's a decent price, doesn't look like any great difference between it and the later production but the Custom Shop Edition logo does add to the value.

The orphan three-point will make a nice doorstop.
Title: Re: 1987 pre-regular line Custom Shop TB IV
Post by: uwe on February 22, 2011, 12:49:07 PM
This is probably not any more "Custom Shop" (in the sense of premium quality) than the Q-80ies the CS churned out at the same time. More likely the CS had nothing to do so they let them build the first 50. Wonder whether the larger headstock will make a sound dif. Herr Carlston will let us know.

Once he's awake that is.
Title: Re: 1987 pre-regular line Custom Shop TB IV
Post by: TBird1958 on February 22, 2011, 01:03:38 PM



 Ended already!
Title: Re: 1987 pre-regular line Custom Shop TB IV
Post by: uwe on February 22, 2011, 01:04:47 PM
Mark is a bit slow today.  ;)
Title: Re: 1987 pre-regular line Custom Shop TB IV
Post by: Highlander on February 22, 2011, 01:27:37 PM
Congrats...

You must have rolled past the 100th "Gibson" by now - just curious what was the 100th...
Title: Re: 1987 pre-regular line Custom Shop TB IV
Post by: TBird1958 on February 22, 2011, 01:27:59 PM

 Hey!

 I put the S-L, in O-W!



 Plus I'm at work............Damn distractions.
Title: Re: 1987 pre-regular line Custom Shop TB IV
Post by: uwe on February 22, 2011, 01:45:22 PM
Congrats...

You must have rolled past the 100th "Gibson" by now - just curious what was the 100th...

I have no idea! Numbers don't mean anything to me, only completeness does.  :mrgreen:
Title: Re: 1987 pre-regular line Custom Shop TB IV
Post by: Highlander on February 22, 2011, 02:35:31 PM
I guess a family album shot would take one of those extra looooong rolls of continous paper to print out... rather handy most digital cameras come with a built in "stitch" function too... ;D

(completism... that was another well known in other circles German's problem, too...) :o :P
Title: Re: 1987 pre-regular line Custom Shop TB IV
Post by: OldManC on February 22, 2011, 02:40:34 PM
I was wondering what you'd gotten Uwe. I knew it was a bird from the emails but that's all I could find. I should have known there would be a thread here! I'm looking forward to playing with it. I've been wondering about that Hipshot...
Title: Re: 1987 pre-regular line Custom Shop TB IV
Post by: godofthunder on February 22, 2011, 03:11:20 PM
Nice score Uwe!, I was looking at that but no my cup of tea really. I did not notice the jack on top! Makes it all the more special.
Title: Re: 1987 pre-regular line Custom Shop TB IV
Post by: uwe on February 22, 2011, 03:15:09 PM
(http://i.ebayimg.com/07/!CF6l2FgBGk~$(KGrHqV,!iUE1NPYvwFBBNWs2rwW(Q~~_12.JPG)

(http://i.ebayimg.com/00/$(KGrHqR,!jgE0vlrNOmcBNWs2l1zQw~~_12.JPG)

(http://i.ebayimg.com/00/$(KGrHqJ,!jgE0vfd6Q-,BNWs2)kO6Q~~_12.JPG)
Title: Re: 1987 pre-regular line Custom Shop TB IV
Post by: uwe on February 22, 2011, 03:21:34 PM
Nice score Uwe!, I was looking at that ...

Now I'll go to TBird heaven one day. I saved that bass from a ghastly fate ...

(http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_lEioB2FpHYs/R2aRIscUBDI/AAAAAAAADys/nRYyZ90LJlY/s320/Sawdust.jpg)


 :mrgreen: :mrgreen: :mrgreen: :mrgreen: :mrgreen:
Title: Re: 1987 pre-regular line Custom Shop TB IV
Post by: godofthunder on February 22, 2011, 03:24:25 PM
That bass has no idea how lucky it is.......................
Title: Re: 1987 pre-regular line Custom Shop TB IV
Post by: godofthunder on February 22, 2011, 03:26:15 PM
 I hesitate to ask  :rolleyes:  ........................does it have a large headstock?
Title: Re: 1987 pre-regular line Custom Shop TB IV
Post by: uwe on February 22, 2011, 03:33:40 PM
It looks like it from the size of the open gear tuners, look how far apart they are in pic 3.

Hush little TBird, and do sleep well, Uncle Scott won't take you to Badass hell.  :rimshot:


Now the only thing I'm worried about  :rolleyes: is whether a prolonged stay in Utah might not turn the TB bass into a TP bass. TP as in Tea Party ... Indoctrination can be sneaky ...
Title: Re: 1987 pre-regular line Custom Shop TB IV
Post by: godofthunder on February 22, 2011, 03:39:31 PM
 Yeah it looks looks it to me also, makes it even cooler!  The  Butcherbird the object of Uwe's ire. Bass looks very happy and usefull to me! (http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v102/godofthunder59/2552578120083345702PEYuMe_ph.jpg)
Title: Re: 1987 pre-regular line Custom Shop TB IV
Post by: uwe on February 22, 2011, 03:42:56 PM
Yes, it does seem to be accorded with Geneva Convention treatment!


(http://www.alabamaheritage.com/images/vaultimages/07aliceville/07aliceville21_600.jpg)
Title: Re: 1987 pre-regular line Custom Shop TB IV
Post by: TBird1958 on February 22, 2011, 04:06:47 PM

 I've got a couple spare black 3 points...............Happy to just send you one if you promise to take the "thing" off of it.    ;)
Title: Re: 1987 pre-regular line Custom Shop TB IV
Post by: godofthunder on February 22, 2011, 04:52:01 PM
A generous offer Mark but the thing stays  ;D Hmmmmmmmmmmmm now what to do about that extra hole ;) (http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v102/godofthunder59/Charwithmytbird001.jpg)
Title: Re: 1987 pre-regular line Custom Shop TB IV
Post by: TBird1958 on February 22, 2011, 05:15:28 PM


 ;D

   I meant Uwe!


Extra hole aside.....
I'm afraid you're far past my being able to help you Scott  :mrgreen:

 
Title: Re: 1987 pre-regular line Custom Shop TB IV
Post by: uwe on February 22, 2011, 05:33:55 PM
I might reinstall the three point for historical accuracy AND because it is a sensible bridge. But let's hear first what Herr Carlston thinks of the Supertone.
Title: Re: 1987 pre-regular line Custom Shop TB IV
Post by: godofthunder on February 22, 2011, 06:07:12 PM
 Even I would put the three point back on!  ;D
Title: Re: 1987 pre-regular line Custom Shop TB IV
Post by: Bionic-Joe on February 22, 2011, 06:48:31 PM
I think it IS a Big Headstock bird!!!! NICE SCORE, Uwe!!!!!
Title: Re: 1987 pre-regular line Custom Shop TB IV
Post by: Dave W on February 22, 2011, 07:44:22 PM
By all means, put the three point back on. Nobody wants a well-designed easy-to-adjust bridge.  :P :P :P
Title: Re: 1987 pre-regular line Custom Shop TB IV
Post by: bassvirtuoso on February 22, 2011, 08:05:55 PM
That looks like the one floating around TB a few weeks ago. Wonder why it got turned around so fast?


By the way, I love my supertone bridge.
Title: Re: 1987 pre-regular line Custom Shop TB IV
Post by: Freuds_Cat on February 22, 2011, 08:20:06 PM
I love the funcionality of the Supertone but I still struggle with its looks. I'm with Scott in regards Badass 1 bridges.
Not sold on the whole Dimarzio thing though.

Nice score Uwe.
Title: Re: 1987 pre-regular line Custom Shop TB IV
Post by: Nocturnal on February 22, 2011, 09:31:45 PM

By the way, I love my supertone bridge.

Same here! I like it much better than the 3-point. It may not be the prettiest bridge, but then neither are Gibson's.
Title: Re: 1987 pre-regular line Custom Shop TB IV
Post by: uwe on February 23, 2011, 03:30:53 AM
What I like about the three point is that it doesn't have this massive plate obstructing the surface of the bass' top, yet isn't flimsy either with those three large studs. I'm not aware of any other bridge like that. It doesn't look utalitarian yet is. In comparison, both the Badass and the Supertone have put purpose over visual design which is sensible and generally good designing - form follows function -, but having both once in a while is nice too.

But this bass' prototype status warrants that its original look be reinstated. I have the Supertone on my Blackbird and it looks nicely industrial ON THAT TYPE OF TBird, gives a little more sustain (but just like a Ric a TBird is inherently already a sustain-rich bass so there is nothing really gained that way) than the three point and lets you lower the action a little more evenly, but the effects are not startling. I have not felt compelled to repeat the exercise with any other bass. Then again if that bass should play like a dream with it, I might keep it on there.
Title: Re: 1987 pre-regular line Custom Shop TB IV
Post by: uwe on February 23, 2011, 03:40:15 AM
That looks like the one floating around TB a few weeks ago. Wonder why it got turned around so fast?


By the way, I love my supertone bridge.

I don't think the guy knew what he was selling. He latched on to the Custom Shop decal, yes, but wasn't aware of the front jack, open gear tuners, larger headstock nor the fact that this bass preceded the 1987 reissue of the TB IV. If he had he would have done a bit more window dressing in his description and addressed collectors more. Which would have seen me have more competiton than I did! I stumbled on this purely by accident half an hour before the auction would have closed. The 1987 caught my eye, I thought "oh, this is an early one then" and as I enlarged the pic I saw the front jack and the headstock looked a bit oversized ... (I actually do feel that purely from a design perspective the smaller headstock of later TBirds looks better. The old size was overdoing things a little visually.)
Title: Re: 1987 pre-regular line Custom Shop TB IV
Post by: Basvarken on February 23, 2011, 04:02:46 AM
I have the Supertone on my Blackbird and it looks nicely industrial ON THAT TYPE OF TBird, gives a little more sustain (but just like a Ric a TBird is inherently already a sustain-rich bass so there is nothing really gained that way) than the three point re.

Really? I find it had to believe.
I'd say the three point bridge allows for a more pure way of transporting the frequencies onto the body.
The Hipshot (and Badass) have this big lump of metal to absorb the frequencies.

Calling the Hipshot bridge a SuperTone is kinda pretentious if you ask me  :-\
Title: Re: 1987 pre-regular line Custom Shop TB IV
Post by: Basshappi on February 23, 2011, 08:11:50 AM
Congrats Uwe!
Title: Re: 1987 pre-regular line Custom Shop TB IV
Post by: Nocturnal on February 23, 2011, 08:13:03 AM
The Hipshot blends in nicely on my ebony Bird so the looks don't bother me. If it was a vintage Bird I would be inclined to go with the original 3-point for the overall look of the bass. It all comes down to what you like best, and I don't think either is the "wrong" choice.
Title: Re: 1987 pre-regular line Custom Shop TB IV
Post by: Dave W on February 23, 2011, 08:24:02 AM
Really? I find it had to believe.
I'd say the three point bridge allows for a more pure way of transporting the frequencies onto the body.
The Hipshot (and Badass) have this big lump of metal to absorb the frequencies.

More string energy going into the body = less sustain

More string energy retained in the strings = more sustain

That lump of metal acts as an inertia block to help prevent those frequencies from going into the body. How well it works depends on how well the bridge is designed.

I never understood this until I read an explanation by Mica Wickersham of Alembic. It's why Alembics have a big brass "tone plate" under their bridge, it keeps more energy in the strings, increases sustain and minimizes the effect of the body woods on tone.

Quote
Calling the Hipshot bridge a SuperTone is kinda pretentious if you ask me  :-\

Agreed
Title: Re: 1987 pre-regular line Custom Shop TB IV
Post by: nofi on February 23, 2011, 08:42:30 AM
which raises a question i always have. why would someone want more sustain in a bass. i have never undestood why.
Title: Re: 1987 pre-regular line Custom Shop TB IV
Post by: Dave W on February 23, 2011, 08:47:12 AM
Any solid body bass has plenty enough sustain for me.
Title: Re: 1987 pre-regular line Custom Shop TB IV
Post by: Basvarken on February 23, 2011, 09:37:35 AM
That explanation makes sense Dave.
But does that also mean the more sustain the less tone?

Title: Re: 1987 pre-regular line Custom Shop TB IV
Post by: uwe on February 23, 2011, 09:57:40 AM
The more sustain the less snap and attack perhaps. And wood tone. I hear less alder or ash (or whatever non-descript plant remnants these folks from California use ...  :) ) in a P or J with a heavy duty bridge (think Geddy Lee Signature) than on those with the flimsy original bridge. And those are snappier, livelier too, the only drawback is that high notes die pretty quickly and don't really sing. They are more percussive though.

Why would you want more sustain on a bass? You certainly don't need it for the deep tones, but when playing upper register notes that you want to let "stand" rather than quick percussive runs, then the sustain of a TBird or Ric is just sweeter (and beefier) than of a bolt-on bass no matter what the bridge.
Title: Re: 1987 pre-regular line Custom Shop TB IV
Post by: dadagoboi on February 23, 2011, 11:08:36 AM
Congrats on the bass Uwe!  I think it deserves to have its original bridge.

A properly cut nut and string saddles also have a great deal to do with sustain. 
Title: Re: 1987 pre-regular line Custom Shop TB IV
Post by: Barklessdog on February 23, 2011, 11:46:57 AM
Quote
I never understood this until I read an explanation by Mica Wickersham of Alembic. It's why Alembics have a big brass "tone plate" under their bridge, it keeps more energy in the strings, increases sustain and minimizes the effect of the body woods on tone.

My Lp bass has a plate under the bridge, but I thought it to be a flat surface to withstand the height adjustment tension?
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v104/Fenderbird/MY%20BASSES/moneyshot.jpg)
Title: Re: 1987 pre-regular line Custom Shop TB IV
Post by: Freuds_Cat on February 23, 2011, 12:35:06 PM
My Jazz must be the exception to the rule. The countersunk Badass1 gives me huge sustain which makes the upper mids and higher notes sing a little more and the lower notes hold their warmth longer during parts of a song where I'm required to hang on one note waiting for the next section to start. I've ;earned over the years to use the side of my hand as a dampner when its needed and also my fingers. These days its just part of my technique that I dont even think about when I'm playing.

At the same time I have constantly had musicians remark on the tone of this bass. Even a few from this forum.

The Supertone that went on the Pearl Export here actually improved the tone and only added a little sustain. The ST was quite light compared to a Badass 1. Also the bridge on the PE was very obviously made of cheap alloy because it had bent due to string tension so an improvement in sound was almost inevitable.
Title: Re: 1987 pre-regular line Custom Shop TB IV
Post by: Dave W on February 23, 2011, 05:35:05 PM
That explanation makes sense Dave.
But does that also mean the more sustain the less tone?


The more sustain the less snap and attack perhaps. And wood tone. I hear less alder or ash (or whatever non-descript plant remnants these folks from California use ...  :) ) in a P or J with a heavy duty bridge (think Geddy Lee Signature) than on those with the flimsy original bridge. And those are snappier, livelier too, the only drawback is that high notes die pretty quickly and don't really sing. They are more percussive though.


Uwe's description is very good. I do think that a very heavy bridge does have a negative effect on tone. Fortunately most of the aftermarket bridges aren't that extreme. The Badass will increase sustain over a standard Fender bridge, but it's a large piece of die cast zinc. If it were solid brass at that size it might be a tone killer.

There's one other effect a bridge can have besides keeping energy in the strings or transmitting it to the body: it can waste string energy. For example, when the height screws on the saddles of a standard Fender bridge vibrate against the base plate. So there must be pros and cons to every design.

Carlo's right about the nut slots and saddles, and let's not forget the tuners. A bad tuner design can waste some string energy and a heavier design will act in the same way as a heavier bridge, but the effect is not as noticeable. 
Title: Re: 1987 pre-regular line Custom Shop TB IV
Post by: Dave W on February 23, 2011, 05:46:29 PM
Something else to consider: no matter what hype you hear from a manufacturer, sustain and resonance are opposites.

Think about it. Resonance happens when string energy is transferred to the body, sustain happens when it stays in the strings.  There's no way to get 100% of both. You have to find a balance that works for you.
Title: Re: 1987 pre-regular line Custom Shop TB IV
Post by: Chris P. on February 24, 2011, 02:10:55 AM
Both parts of the Warwick-bridge are sunk deeply into the body.
Title: Re: 1987 pre-regular line Custom Shop TB IV
Post by: uwe on February 24, 2011, 06:37:35 AM
Which is why some peole say all Warwicks sound alike no matter what wood they use, that Kingtiger tank of a bridge is the determining sound factor. The budget Rock Basses used to have less massive bridges (pretty much Fenderish) and those basses did sound different. I believe that the new Rock Basses have the Warwick Kingtiger bridge now though.

(http://www.welt.de/multimedia/archive/00406/Koenigstiger_DW_Kul_406876a.jpg)
Title: Re: 1987 pre-regular line Custom Shop TB IV
Post by: uwe on February 24, 2011, 06:39:38 AM
My Lp bass has a plate under the bridge, but I thought it to be a flat surface to withstand the height adjustment tension?
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v104/Fenderbird/MY%20BASSES/moneyshot.jpg)

Naw, it's a chunk of metal as thick as the upper part.
Title: Re: 1987 pre-regular line Custom Shop TB IV
Post by: sniper on February 24, 2011, 08:05:50 AM
what change in tone might a 'tail piece' add or subtract to a bass? i know it will theoretically lengthen the string base but what effect does that have on tone?

i really did not notice any change when i added one to my Epi, but that cheap pup might not have the quality needed to notice a change! i installed the EB pup after the tailpiece was already there so i had no way to A - B compare it. i do like the EB pup.
Title: Re: 1987 pre-regular line Custom Shop TB IV
Post by: Chris P. on February 24, 2011, 08:08:35 AM
There are all kinds of theories on string lenghts and the reversed headstock on a Strat (like Jimi palyinga right handed Strat on a lefty way).
Title: Re: 1987 pre-regular line Custom Shop TB IV
Post by: Dave W on February 24, 2011, 09:09:53 AM
The Warwick bridge and tailpiece are sunken because the neck isn't angled, not for any tonal reason. If it were surface mounted, you would have to have an angled neck as on the Gibson LP Bass.

Tailpieces, reversed headstocks etc. can affect the feel of the strings, and they might even affect tone in some small way. They don't affect actual string tension.
Title: Re: 1987 pre-regular line Custom Shop TB IV
Post by: exiledarchangel on February 24, 2011, 11:54:48 AM
String break angle has some minor effect on the sound, big angles make the sound a little softer. In my LP guitar there's a minor difference when I string it like a wraparound bridge. Here's some pictures to understand better what my poor english try to tell you:

Normal (sharper angle, more attack)

(http://www.gibson.com/Files/USA/Proprietary-Guitars/Les-Paul-Studio-Mahogany-Top/LPSM6SECH1/Batched/LPSM6SECH1-Features-Tailpiece.jpg)

"wraparoundey" (blunter angle, mellower attack)

(http://www.mylespaul.com/gallery/data/500/medium/DSC04311.jpg)

I prefer the wraparound method, even if the effect is minimal, because its more comfortably to rest my right hand on the bridge.
Title: Re: 1987 pre-regular line Custom Shop TB IV
Post by: mc2NY on February 25, 2011, 07:21:06 AM
But this bass' prototype status warrants that its original look be reinstated. I have the Supertone on my Blackbird and it looks nicely industrial ON THAT TYPE OF TBird, gives a little more sustain (but just like a Ric a TBird is inherently already a sustain-rich bass so there is nothing really gained that way) than the three point and lets you lower the action a little more evenly, but the effects are not startling. I have not felt compelled to repeat the exercise with any other bass. Then again if that bass should play like a dream with it, I might keep it on there.

I don't know if I'd give it prototype status. Gibson made a lot more of these in 1987 than the Tbird II run of 1986 for the Jap dealers.

I've seen several of these from this 1987 run for sale over the last 5 years or so. They all look the same as this one and have the black hardware and '80s Custom Shop decal.

One I saw was a cast-off from the old LA Guns bassist (Johnny Crypt) and signed on the pickguard. Another was in NYC area. There was also one in the UK for awhile but I think it had a headstock repair.
Title: Re: 1987 pre-regular line Custom Shop TB IV
Post by: uwe on February 25, 2011, 07:58:46 AM
It's prototypish in a way that it combines old (the headstock and the frontjack) and new (the TB Plus pups). Kind of the missing link between the 1986 Japan run, which was still very Bicentennial, and the regular new Birds in late 1987. I guess that on the basis of these Custom Shop babies they decided to downsize the headstock and move the front jack to the side - both of which, if I may voice a minority opinion, I thought to be progression. You see a lot fewer of the new ones with broken headstocks and they are less neckheavy too. I know, purists will disagree. And I find side jacks much preferable to front ones - I've ripped out the entrails of front jack basses a couple of times in my bass playing life, but it has never happened to me with a side jack.

That said, after 25 years in service, the current TB IV could use some revamping and I don't mean change of hardware from black to chrome, that is just cosmetics. They could gently deepen the cutaway, try some different pups in different positions (or just put one in a sweet spot as a rejuvenated TB II), offer a three pup model (TB III anyone?) etc.
Title: Re: 1987 pre-regular line Custom Shop TB IV
Post by: godofthunder on February 25, 2011, 08:35:53 AM
Gently Deepen the cutaway ? What a good idea  ;D (http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v102/godofthunder59/Charwithmytbird001.jpg)
Title: Re: 1987 pre-regular line Custom Shop TB IV
Post by: uwe on February 25, 2011, 09:27:41 AM
Scott for Master Luthier at Gibson!!!
Title: Re: 1987 pre-regular line Custom Shop TB IV
Post by: TBird1958 on February 25, 2011, 10:58:42 AM


 A little arm carve......Helps a lot!

(http://i222.photobucket.com/albums/dd306/veronicasteed/TECH065.jpg)

The backside is quite sculpted, a tummy cut and a lot material removed for upper fret access without changing the shape when viewed from the front.
 
(http://i222.photobucket.com/albums/dd306/veronicasteed/orange004.jpg)
Title: Re: 1987 pre-regular line Custom Shop TB IV
Post by: uwe on February 25, 2011, 11:46:34 AM
I see screws!!!!!  :mrgreen:

But if truth be told, the sculpting is nicely done.
Title: Re: 1987 pre-regular line Custom Shop TB IV
Post by: sniper on February 25, 2011, 11:50:43 AM
i have not paid attention to the back of the "LullBird". the screwed joint does not seem to be as obtrusive as some set or through necks i have seen. nice!
Title: Re: 1987 pre-regular line Custom Shop TB IV
Post by: TBird1958 on February 25, 2011, 11:56:01 AM

You do see screws, it's a very tight neck joint.

 I'm not much of an upper fret player, but I do like how that's addressed in Mike's rework. Ergonomics are improved and the bass "plays" very nicely with no balance or reach issues. As I've said before I really belive Gibson has the shape "right" and I can easily spot theirs vs. an Epi, etc. I'm hopelessly in love with 'Birds  ;)
Title: Re: 1987 pre-regular line Custom Shop TB IV
Post by: Highlander on February 25, 2011, 03:09:30 PM
Talking about body cave-ins and cutaways - post my rebuild the "jack" is in the side, and Mr Cook certainly went more radical with the neck access way back in '72

(http://i655.photobucket.com/albums/uu280/kjrstewart/Peter%20Cook%20Custom/strip006.jpg)
Title: Re: 1987 pre-regular line Custom Shop TB IV
Post by: Denis on February 25, 2011, 05:47:45 PM

(http://www.welt.de/multimedia/archive/00406/Koenigstiger_DW_Kul_406876a.jpg)

Congrats on the nifty T-bird!

Those are Fallschirmjäger troops on that King Tiger, by the way.
Title: Re: 1987 pre-regular line Custom Shop TB IV
Post by: eb2 on February 26, 2011, 08:49:34 AM
So, who is going to buy this?

http://cgi.ebay.com/CRAZY-vtg-GIBSON-THUNDERBIRD-bass-GUITAR-T-SHIRT-WOW-/200580631683?pt=Vintage_Unisex_T_Shirts&hash=item2eb3898c83
Title: Re: 1987 pre-regular line Custom Shop TB IV
Post by: Dave W on February 26, 2011, 09:20:04 AM
So, who is going to buy this?

http://cgi.ebay.com/CRAZY-vtg-GIBSON-THUNDERBIRD-bass-GUITAR-T-SHIRT-WOW-/200580631683?pt=Vintage_Unisex_T_Shirts&hash=item2eb3898c83

If he gets $40 for that, look for Gibson to come out with a reissue for $80.
Title: Re: 1987 pre-regular line Custom Shop TB IV
Post by: sniper on February 26, 2011, 09:47:17 AM
... Those are Fallschirmjäger troops on that King Tiger, by the way.

Reading about the Fallschirmjager troops and the weaponry they used is very interesting. Especially the developement of the FG 42 rifle and its impact on modern rifles, notibly the M-14, M-60 and variants like the M-39 EMR and the M1941 Johnson machine gun. The FG 42 is the basis of todays assault rifle designs.

Interesting research if you care to follow through.

There has to be a conection to the Gibson Custom Shop T-Bird in there somewhere!!!  ;) ;D
Title: Re: 1987 pre-regular line Custom Shop TB IV
Post by: PhilT on February 26, 2011, 10:13:59 AM
So, if sustain is about keeping the vibration in the strings - string through the body gives what? Less sustain, more resonance?
Title: Re: 1987 pre-regular line Custom Shop TB IV
Post by: Denis on February 26, 2011, 10:23:30 AM
Reading about the Fallschirmjager troops and the weaponry they used is very interesting. Especially the developement of the FG 42 rifle and its impact on modern rifles, notibly the M-14, M-60 and variants like the M-39 EMR and the M1941 Johnson machine gun. The FG 42 is the basis of todays assauut rifle designs.

Interesting research if you care to follow through.

There has to be a conection to the Gibson Custom Shop T-Bird in there somewhere!!!  ;) ;D

I think the M60 was developed more using the MG42 as a basis: more of a heavy machine gun. The FG 42 was more of an assault rifle. The early ones had a crazy, extremely angled pistol grip. I'd own one!


Hmm, seeking a Gibson connection to German weapons, maybe the all used "illegally" obtained wood?
Title: Re: 1987 pre-regular line Custom Shop TB IV
Post by: sniper on February 26, 2011, 11:12:34 AM
So, if sustain is about keeping the vibration in the strings - string through the body gives what? Less sustain, more resonance?

that would explain why i see pictures of string through basses with the e and a through strung and the other two on the bridge or tailpiece or vice versa.

(http://i170.photobucket.com/albums/u275/cathousemouse/rods%20projects%20and%20sold/Hipshot2piecebridge.jpg)
Title: Re: 1987 pre-regular line Custom Shop TB IV
Post by: Iome on February 26, 2011, 12:37:16 PM
that would explain why i see pictures of string through basses with the e and a through strung and the other two on the bridge or tailpiece or vice versa.

(http://i170.photobucket.com/albums/u275/cathousemouse/rods%20projects%20and%20sold/Hipshot2piecebridge.jpg)

I believe that's done to show you can use the bridge with both systems
Title: Re: 1987 pre-regular line Custom Shop TB IV
Post by: sniper on February 26, 2011, 01:16:57 PM
oh  :-[
Title: Re: 1987 pre-regular line Custom Shop TB IV
Post by: Dave W on February 26, 2011, 02:25:21 PM
So, if sustain is about keeping the vibration in the strings - string through the body gives what? Less sustain, more resonance?

Not much string energy will make it past the bridge saddles. Everything makes some difference, at least in feel, maybe an audible difference. But the bridge is where most of the energy is transmitted to the body or not.
Title: Re: 1987 pre-regular line Custom Shop TB IV
Post by: uwe on February 28, 2011, 04:58:48 AM
I would expect that a string-thru set up gives more sustain as there is greater saddle pressure while non-string thru with less saddle pressure will let the bass breathe more and sound more resonant. As such the set-up in the above pics (which I have seen before on other bridges too) does make sense as more than just a demonstration of what can be done. Deep sounding E and A with lively D and G is a preference of many bassists.
Title: Re: 1987 pre-regular line Custom Shop TB IV
Post by: JZumbro on March 02, 2011, 10:33:44 PM
I believe that's done to show you can use the bridge with both systems

I've actually done that before though, on purpose. I had a five string bass (never mind the brand....) where the B string in a set of strings was too big and wouldn't fit through the top load hole, but would fit strung through the body. So I had the B through the body and all the rest through the bridge.
Title: Re: 1987 pre-regular line Custom Shop TB IV
Post by: uwe on March 31, 2011, 03:11:30 AM
Uhum.

 
This is just a placeholder for Herr Carlston's imminent comprehensive pictorial report on the thing.  8)


Or is it that horrible you don't even touch it?  :-\