Band priority clash...

[Pilgrim]

I'm feeling down right now, mainly because of a conflict of priorities with the lead guitar player in my new band.  He has played for years, and right now he's out of work and has plenty of time to devote to music.  I'm not a pro and have no desire to be one, and I'm full-time employed with a number of additional responsibilities such as online teaching and serving on two boards that severely limit the time I have available for practice.

We're working up about two hours of music for a gig in early October, and we're about 80% there.  To me, band practice is supposed to be fun. I come in reasonably prepared, but in some cases there are chord progressions or rhythm patterns I need to work on, and I need the context of the rest of the band to help me out.  But if I am not ready to roll through two or three numbers, he's on my case about not practicing, and not doing what I need to.  He alternates praising my meter and tone with complaints about my not being fully prepared.  I think his expectation is that all band members will spend however many hours are required to have the entire set ready to go, and that band practice is just for getting our mutual timing down and resolving minor details.  I can certainly see that point of view, but it's not an approach I can always conform to, as I just don't have the time to achieve that state of readiness.  I need the band together as a group to work through some things.

If this keeps up, one of us will be leaving the band soon.  He plays in a couple of other bands, but I think he needs this one to generate some $$.  I respect that, but it's also his problem, not mine.  I can only do what I can do - and if playing isn't fun, I'm not interested. I don't respond well to people repeatedly criticizing me, and I'm not looking forward to our next meeting.

The band's goal isn't to gig all the time, but I'm wondering if his notion of how much we can play is quite different than mine...and perhaps that of other members.  I think that would be a good thing to discuss this week.

This is really bugging me right now, as I'm not used to failing at things I want to achieve.  I frankly don't believe that I am failing, but it's clear that his approach and mine need to find a middle ground or one of us will be leaving.  If it comes to that, I'm going to ask for votes from the three other band members and live with the result.

Comments?

[ack1961]

That seems like a fixable situation.
I've never been in a band, but your situation reminds me of some issues we've had to overcome on several of the club/rec hockey teams I play on.
It seems that from time to time, as rosters rotate, or as we get closer to the top of the leagues that we start dealing with differences in our mindset/methodologies.  They always seem insurmountable at first, but they always seem to work their way out in the end.  Usually through just talking it out as teammates.
One of the general rules we have on one of my rec hockey teams is that we sit in the parking lot after games and have a beer and discuss whatever comes to mind.  It turns out that hockey-related issues get solved real quickly.

Parallel to your situation, I'm in this thing for fun, and because I love to play.  The nucleus of our team has been together for almost 10 years (at 4 seasons a year, that's a lot of games together). Better and more skilled players have come and gone in those 10 years, but several have remained. We've all had to adjust our tendencies a bit to keep harmony, but like we always say - there's very little money in this, but the joy and camaraderie cannot be measured - however, it is up to all involved to check themselves & understand that there is more to life than rec hockey, or bar bands, or motorcycle clubs, whatever...treating people with respect and not dismissing anyone's feelings can go a long way towards working out issues.

Usually a dose of reality and parking lot beer does the trick.
I hope you can find a amicable way to sit down and discuss that different people have different tendencies and that this doesn't mean that the end goal is not the same.
The fact that the situation bothers you proves that you want it fixed.  Best of luck - sorry if my response doesn't make any sense.

[Psycho Bass Guy]

Having been there... it sounds like he's clinging to the hope that a tighter band will lead to more gigs and more money. If that's the case, he'll never let go of that delusion until he's not so desperate to need it. Be patient. Have a little empathy for his situation, and realize that he's not trying to be an asshole; he's just being an asshole.  Take his suggestions and smile, but if he continues to push it, take him aside and explain to him that his perfectionism isn't helping you or the band and if he persists, his source of income may disappear.

[Aussie Mark]

in some cases there are chord progressions or rhythm patterns I need to work on, and I need the context of the rest of the band to help me out.  But if I am not ready to roll through two or three numbers, he's on my case about not practicing, and not doing what I need to.

If this is a gigging band playing covers then I'd have to agree with the guitarist.  Scheduled practice is not the place to be learning chord progressions.  If you were the drummer or singer and have learned your parts, how would you feel to be sitting around waiting while the guitarist and bass player to discuss which chords go where?

If it's an original band collaborating on new songs, then it's an entirely different story of course.

[TBird1958]

 2 or 3 songs shouldn't break a gig...... I doubt that if you didn't play those songs anybody would care, you'd likely find something to replace them. More to the point of learning songs tho, everybody does that a bit differently, and if you need the whole band to really nail your parts of a few songs - so be it. I do tend to get my parts down by myself before the band gets together, but more than once it's needed work and a whole band effort for me to get my part right too.
 Your guitarist may not have had this problem yet - but at some point he will. and I'm sure he'll want your patience while he learns.
  

[gweimer]

There is a whole band dynamic which must be allowed to develop.   Everyone involved in the effort has to get what they want from the experience in order for it to work.  I've almost NEVER learned songs note for note before coming into practice.  In fact, I'm not the best person to practice alone for hours on end.  I've never learned how to do it.  That said, my ears do most of my work.  I'll listen to songs forever and work the parts out in my head.  Sometimes, my fingers know what to do before I've actually wrapped my head around it.  The bottom line is that in nearly every band situation in the past 40 years, I've been brought in because of how/what I play.  Come gig time, it's all pretty much ready to go, or I can fake my way past the few rough spots.

That said, tell Francis, your guitarist, to unbunch his panties from his butt.  Not everyone in the group is going to have the same priorities in life or music that he does.  He needs to back off, and try to make the band work.  I honestly find that the occasional goofing off night and screwing around can make the band better in the long run.  Those tend to help bring about nights when it's all business.  No matter whether you are full-time original band, or just a cover band playing really bad bars for little money, these guys/gals are people you are going to spend a LOT of time with.  It's never all business.  You do your best, you admit your weaknesses, and you lay out your priorities.  When everyone's personal goals can be met, and nobody gets offended or bent out of shape, you have a band worth staying with for a long time.

[Pilgrim]

Gweimer, you summed it up nicely.

I just got off the phone with the other guitarist in the band, who I have played with for years and whom I consider my friend, and the situation is clear.  The rest of the band not only wants to, but needs to, use the band as a means of generating income.  They also have the available practice time to put in the hours needed to get music ready quickly, and they want to play out as often as possible.

None of that is a fit for me.  I don't need the money, and I don't have the time to practice most nights or play every weekend.  Between my full-time job, teaching online, serving on advisory boards and sundry other obligations, I'm just not a fit.  I had already decided that if they wanted to play out more than twice a month, I needed to bow out and let them get a bass player who could support them - because I can't do that.  No time, and no desire to change my life to accommodate it.

What I can do is stay in a hobby band, and that's what I'll do.  The guitarist I spoke with tonight was in my previous surf band, and he wants to continue playing surf music.  We'll find a drummer and have some fun with it.  I'm not sure how his time will work out, but it is a better fit for me.

As for the guy who was on my case, he has his own demons to work out.  Although he was correct his assessment of the time I could invest, he was rude and I had no desire to continue working with him if he was going to behave in that manner.  My aggravation level has dropped off radically in the hour that has passed since I learned I don't have to worry about interacting with him any more.

[Hornisse]

If this is a gigging band playing covers then I'd have to agree with the guitarist.  Scheduled practice is not the place to be learning chord progressions.  If you were the drummer or singer and have learned your parts, how would you feel to be sitting around waiting while the guitarist and bass player to discuss which chords go where?

If it's an original band collaborating on new songs, then it's an entirely different story of course.

Glad you got it worked out.  And +1 on what Mark said.  So was it an original or cover band? 

[Pilgrim]

Covers....some of which I'd never heard, so it was taking me a while to get a feel for them.  It's not easy for me to quickly learn something Ive never heard!  Given the fact that I'll probably always use practice to polish  some of those details, it worked out for the best.

I've also learned that YouTube can be your good friend or worst enemy in this process.  A great audio quality transfer is very helpful in learning the music - a bad, fuzzy, distorted or pitch-shifted transfer is the pits.  

[Hornisse]

Having been in the same cover band for over 8 years now (with a few well deserved breaks in between) I've learned 100's of songs.  Some I never heard of for sure, but a lot of the stuff we do I've heard over the years.  It is a lot tougher starting from scratch with a band.  When I joined them in 2002 I had roughly 6 weeks to prepare 50 songs!  Plus I had not played in a band the prior 2 years.  It helped that the other guys knew what they were doing.    I switched to 5 string basses in 2006 because we were doing so many songs that required it.  I still remember taking my SR5 to the gig with no 4 string in sight!  I can't play a 4 string at a gig now because I miss the extra string.  (I even tried a 6 string at a gig in Houston, but it was just too much for me) 

[Aussie Mark]

Having been in the same cover band for over 8 years now (with a few well deserved breaks in between) I've learned 100's of songs.  Some I never heard of for sure, but a lot of the stuff we do I've heard over the years.  It is a lot tougher starting from scratch with a band.  When I joined them in 2002 I had roughly 6 weeks to prepare 50 songs! 

It certainly gets easier over time, with the process of learning 40 or 50 songs in 2 or 3 weeks becoming very efficient.  The first thing I do if I've got a fill-in gig coming up, or learning the complete repertoire for a new band, is grab every song on the list and put it on a CD in mp3 format, so I can play the lot every time I'm in the car.  I also load them onto my Blackberry so I can listen to them any spare moment I get - in the gym, watching the kids at swimming class etc.  I spend an hour or so grabbing any existing tab off the web (cut and paste into one document that I print out as an initial reference point).  As I learn the songs I chart out the chords myself with cheat notes if I'm not overly familiar with the song ("chromatic run here", "boogie riffs in this verse", "blues box" etc)

YouTube is a last resort for me in terms of learning new songs - I usually get the other guys in the band to give me what they have on CD, and I grab the rest via my own CD collection or Limewire if I'm stuck.

Our Stones tribute band rehearsed just twice before we started gigging, because we all did our homework in between rehearsals.  It helped that we were all Stones fans and very familiar with the songs in our heads already.  The only problems we encountered were things like "Are we doing the studio version or the Ya Yas version?" and things like that.

[jumbodbassman]

there is always tension when a band has "full time musicians" and part timers.  And i would broadly define full time as more needing the money to pay the bills versus playing to have fun.  If the rest of the band is in that same mindset then you are better off parting as friends.  If he is the only one in that situation then maybe he should think about selling out and  playing weddings for some decent steady money

[Pilgrim]

there is always tension when a band has "full time musicians" and part timers.  And i would broadly define full time as more needing the money to pay the bills versus playing to have fun.  If the rest of the band is in that same mindset then you are better off parting as friends.  If he is the only one in that situation then maybe he should think about selling out and  playing weddings for some decent steady money

I had a good talk with my guitarist friend last night and I confirmed that the other guys really DO need to generate income, and quickly.  All of them are strapped.  One's out of work, one is retired, and the other two work at 8-5 jobs that don't require thought after they leave.  My situation is completely different - university work, professional associations, advisory boards and other activities.  Our goals and schedules are completely incompatible.

I just CANNOT practice enough to keep up, nor do I have the time to play out as much as they need to.  I could play out twice a month if I strained to do it - they want to be out every week.  It's best that we sorted that out in the first month so that they can find the right bass player.  I feel much better to get this sorted out - it's not lack of ability on my part, it's incompatible goals and schedules.  The guitarist was still a butt popping off the way he did (he may have been correct, but he was very rude in the way he expressed it) - but that's something I don't have to deal with any longer, which is a pleasure.  He and I weren't meant to be in a long-term band relationship anyway.

[Highlander]

FUN and ENJOYMENT is the priority in all modes of life - everything else is a DAY-JOB...

I've quit bands back when I was semi pro when this rule failed to apply...

[Pilgrim]

FUN and ENJOYMENT is the priority in all modes of life - everything else is a DAY-JOB...

I've quit bands back when I was semi pro when this rule failed to apply...

I bow to you and your wisdom, sir!  (And to the squirrels on your left and right.)