Author Topic: Rabbits, race cars, guitars and good vibrations.  (Read 1135 times)

sniper

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Rabbits, race cars, guitars and good vibrations.
« on: December 17, 2010, 11:14:23 PM »
Inspired by this thread: http://bassoutpost.com/index.php?topic=4970.0

FWIW

When I was a young man learning to hunt I read an article about how to “seat” your rifle. It involved protecting/greasing the action and barrel and glue setting said barrel into a bit of glue one would put in the stock. The theory was to get the greatest contact along the barrel of the rifle and the stock to reduce vibrations from influencing the bullet as it traveled down the barrel. Now the idea is a thick barrel free floating, but it was a start of a good idea. I used "bondo" in my 22 Winchester single shot.

Later in life when I was involved with race cars, we would “seat” the driver (with a good racing magazine because the driver had to set still for at least an hour) while we basically put expanding foam in a garbage bag and set said driver on top of the bag which was in the drivers seat. Again the idea was to keep the driver from moving around while strapped in the seat maximizing body contact with the car and keeping said drivers butt from sliding around at all while the car was moving. Foam dried and wa-lah a form fitted seat.

Now in later years I am concerned about seating a bolt on neck into a wooden body while still maintaining the convenience of being able to break down the guitar for repair or a new setup ranging from playing with the truss rod for some change or whatever else the instrument might need and being able to return it to my optimum playing state of assembly (neck angle and knowing the vibrations of the body will still have maximum effect on the neck).

1)   If I a going to use a bolt on neck, I will use threaded metal inserts in the neck

2)   I reserve the right to also use plastic kitchen wrap, epoxy and wax to “seat” the neck and do it in sort of the race car fashion by using a small sheet of plastic wrap to protect the neck from getting glued in by spreading a bit of wax on said wrap, spreading a small amount of epoxy in the neck cavity then bolting on the neck at a previously predetermined neck angle (which might include a wedge shim or wire screening) from setting up the instrument.

3)   Letting the assembly set until the epoxy is dry and give it a test disassemble, reassemble to see if it returns to the previous state.

The micro surface of the neck and the dry epoxy should now match perfectly allowing the greatest amount of vibrations to transfer to the neck from the body of the guitar while still being able to disassemble the instrument if needed and not letting the neck move while it is being played.

Yeah you will probaly have to trim away some epoxy from the edges when it done.

Just a thought for whats its worth.

I can be true to you sweety until I find a nice medium scale with great breasts. ... CW

dadagoboi

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Re: Rabbits, race cars, guitars and good vibrations.
« Reply #1 on: December 18, 2010, 08:11:02 AM »
You've thought this through and should give it a shot.  Dan Erlewine suggests using a tapered neck shim to achieve  greater surface area contact and prevent any warp that might occur.  I tried that but didn't have the patience to make an accurate shim with that slight a taper.


Pilgrim

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Re: Rabbits, race cars, guitars and good vibrations.
« Reply #2 on: December 18, 2010, 09:46:34 AM »
If I were going to do #2, I'd make sure the butt of the neck was ever so slightly wider at the top (fretboard side) than the bottom, like so:

\__/  

...so that it wouldn't get locked into the cavity.  My experience is that a really tight fitting neck can exert a lot of pressure on the sides of the cavity when trying to remove it...might even split wood.  Just 1 to 2 mm of taper would be enough to seat it well but allow it to be removed when needed.

Just off the top of my head....
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sniper

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Re: Rabbits, race cars, guitars and good vibrations.
« Reply #3 on: December 18, 2010, 06:40:47 PM »
You've thought this through and should give it a shot.  Dan Erlewine suggests using a tapered neck shim to achieve  greater surface area contact and prevent any warp that might occur.  I tried that but didn't have the patience to make an accurate shim with that slight a taper.



I'm not a builder Carlo. I wish I had the means to do stuff like build but those days are past. I ws just passing on a thought and obviously you guys have thought about it too.

If I were going to do #2, I'd make sure the butt of the neck was ever so slightly wider at the top (fretboard side) than the bottom, like so:

\__/ 

...so that it wouldn't get locked into the cavity.  My experience is that a really tight fitting neck can exert a lot of pressure on the sides of the cavity when trying to remove it...might even split wood.  Just 1 to 2 mm of taper would be enough to seat it well but allow it to be removed when needed.

Just off the top of my head....

If Dan had thought of this then it might be a ratrional thing to do. I would follow his advice and I think the taper is a great idea.
I can be true to you sweety until I find a nice medium scale with great breasts. ... CW

dadagoboi

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Re: Rabbits, race cars, guitars and good vibrations.
« Reply #4 on: December 18, 2010, 07:33:00 PM »
I'm talking about a tapered shim in the bottom of the neck pocket to give the desired neck angle.  I make the pocket sides vertical and an interference fit with the neck.  Some builders, Nash for example, make a wider neck pocket and side shim it.  Makes it easier to align the neck with the bridge centerline.  I don't like neck wiggle and side gap if I can avoid it

Rob

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Re: Rabbits, race cars, guitars and good vibrations.
« Reply #5 on: December 18, 2010, 07:46:58 PM »
The easiest way I have found to make long shims is to tape them to another piece of wood (double sided carpet tape) and then sand them on a belt sander.
You can make a couple pretty quickly that way.  OH! I usually have some idea of how tall the butt end needs to be so I have a stop point.
Rob

dadagoboi

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Re: Rabbits, race cars, guitars and good vibrations.
« Reply #6 on: December 18, 2010, 07:55:54 PM »
Thanks for the tip Rob!