The Last Bass Outpost
Main Forums => The Bass Zone => Topic started by: Dave W on July 20, 2020, 11:59:45 AM
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Not new but I hadn't seen it until this morning.
https://youtu.be/yG7H55V_4O0
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I could be wrong, but to me that sounds like what a guitarist thinks bassists would say. But some of that might really be valid. Like the part about picks. I get so tired of the bias against picks from bassists. I play fingerstyle sometimes, but only because I have neck problems and it puts less pressure on my neck to do it that way. But that guy has a sense of humor in the video and that's what it's all about.
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I could be wrong, but to me that sounds like what a guitarist thinks bassists would say.
:toast:
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I could be wrong, but to me that sounds like what a guitarist thinks bassists would say. But some of that might really be valid. Like the part about picks. I get so tired of the bias against picks from bassists. I play fingerstyle sometimes, but only because I have neck problems and it puts less pressure on my neck to do it that way. But that guy has a sense of humor in the video and that's what it's all about.
You'll hardly ever find a well known bassist putting down another bassist for using a pick. It's almost always third-rate wannabees.
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You'll hardly ever find a well known bassist putting down another bassist for using a pick. It's almost always third-rate wannabees.
Yes, I agree. And I think I've mentioned this here before. But I'm also around other people in real life who are anti-pick, especially one person who is a bassist and a good one. We're the same age, but grew up in different parts of the country. It appears he has always felt playing with a pick is something to be stigmatized. People I grew up with idolized Paul McCartney and Berry Oakley. If you said anything negative about the Beatles or the Allman Brothers, you would have been looked at as having a very poor taste in music. Probably more so even for the Allman Brothers than the Beatles. The Allman Brothers were considered to be music gods by the people I was around as a teenager. Paul McCartney and Berry Oakley used picks back then; so case closed. But fingerstyle and pickstyle were considered equal. Sometimes I have to wonder if at least some of the anti-pick people are so against it because they're not very good using a pick. I don't know. I once saw a video of Bobby Vega. He played with a pick throughout much of the video. Then he switched to fingerstyle. Very impressive either way.
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I believe the stigma sometimes is related to picks being associated with guitarplaying. If you use a pick you're more likely to be considered a failed guitarplayer. I actually agreed to some parts of that video. 2:09-2:16 and 2:34-2:40 for example. As a musician you're more likely to dissect music so that you appreciate it because of single instruments. More so than non musicians that have a harder time to pinpoint why they like a certain song.
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When I started to play bass, I played fingerstyle only.
I had taken guitar lessons from a flamenco teacher and he taught me to use all fingers on my right hand (except for the pinky. don't know why). Hours and hours of training, alternating between the fingers (PAMI, PIAM, PMIA, etc).
It came in handy when I started to play bass in band that did Iron Maiden covers et cetera. Steve Harris was my idol back then ;-)
It wasn't after ten years in a band that I learned to play with a pick. I had started a tribute band doing Thin Lizzy songs. And Phil Lynott had this very steady pulsating right hand pick technique. Again hours and hours of practice to get that down pat.
I'm glad I learned both, because it just extends the palette of choice.
Never been much of a slapper though :mrgreen:
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I believe the stigma sometimes is related to picks being associated with guitarplaying. If you use a pick you're more likely to be considered a failed guitarplayer. ...
It originated way back when by upright players who wouldn't accept the idea of a bass in guitar form. A bass guitar wasn't a "real" bass and therefore anyone who played with a pick wasn't a "real" bassist. It's no wonder they gradually lost gigs to electric bass players.
My usual response to anti-pick people is "real bassists play arco." :)
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My usual response to anti-pick people is "real bassists play arco." :)
:rimshot:
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My usual response to anti-pick people is "real bassists play arco." :)
Pretty much same here, though I don't bother chiming in on stupid anti-pick commentary anymore. :rolleyes: And what about those shameless guitar players playing finger style? ;) I could also mention the list of legendary, respected bass players that play with a pick either all or some of the time. 8)
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Pretty much same here, though I don't bother chiming in on stupid anti-pick commentary anymore. :rolleyes: And what about those shameless guitar players playing finger style? ;) I could also mention the list of legendary, respected bass players that play with a pick either all or some of the time. 8)
Most of my influences play or played with a pick. It doesn't matter to me one way or the other.
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Always played with a pick, until I - all of a sudden, and very surprising - got arthritis in my thumb 35 years ago. Couldn't hold a pick any more. Just dropped it! This was in the middle of a tour of West Sweden, and Norway. So I started using my fingers. The shift was pretty easy.
Need is the mother of invention. You do what you have to do.
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I make sporadic efforts to learn how to use a pick. It would sure come in handy for those steady, repetitive passages that go on and on.
A couple of guitar players have been surprised to see that I tend to use a pick with all upstrokes, which to me seems natural because that's the direction that my fingers pull when playing finger style. I haven't gotten as far as two-direction pick technique.
As a convert from upright bass, I came to electric as a fingers player, and that's definitely my stronger technique. I consider pizzicato to be the foundation of electric bass, with pick as a secondary (but effective) tool.
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I don't have a problem with playing with or without a pick. That is individual choice. I admit I play mainly without a pick but I am working on using a pick also. Faster stuff I deal with playing fingerstyle as picking needs to come up to speed at some point.
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I don't have a problem with playing with or without a pick. That is individual choice. I admit I play mainly without a pick but I am working on using a pick also. Faster stuff I deal with playing fingerstyle as picking needs to come up to speed at some point.
Me too. I'm still faster and more accurate with fingers than a pick.
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When I was a kid, my first bass hero was Entwistle, and he could do both. Then I got into Tony Levin and he could do both. I got into the Talking Heads, and Tina Weymouth could do both. If I asked my bass teacher to teach me a song, he always wanted me to work on whatever technique sounded most like the recording. I just assumed that learning both fingers and pick was part of learning bass! I was surprised when I learned that people would only do one and look askance at the other.
Looking through my current band's recorded output, it looks like I used fingers on 15 songs and pick on 8 songs.
I think in prior bands, I used to be closer to 50/50.
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Same here, but I've had plenty of time the past few years to work on my pick technique. Unfortunately my health keeps me from gigging, not that there's much going on right now.
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You'll hardly ever find a well known bassist putting down another bassist for using a pick. It's almost always third-rate wannabees.
I think that some bassists initially gravitate towards using a pick as it is easier. There is no way you can find fault with Bobby Vega's technique when he's using a pick, but pick playing on a bass is a skill that still has to be mastered. You get more instant results bashing away with a pick, as a beginner bassist, over trying to get consistently speaking notes from fingerstyle playing.
I started playing pick, but I drank the Talkbass Koolaid and though I had to use fingers. Initially I was making more noise than note playing with my fingers. I think in general you can't fake fingerstyle as you can pick playing. Whenever I've gone out to see local bands the worst bassists have consistently use picks. They are either beginners or moonlighting guitarists, and in either case they don't know how to get a consistent tone that actually does the job of underpinning the music. I've never seen somebody seriously fumble the job of bassist who was also a fingerstyle player.
Saying all that, I suck as using pick on a bass. My tonal reference is that clicky, palm muted '60s soundtrack pick tone. I don't get a good sound unless I use a compressor. I'm left handed but play right handed, and my thumbs are double jointed! I can pick fine on a guitar, but I don't have the picking stamina to get good results on bass.
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I've heard a fair share of fingerstyle players who don't know how to underpin the music and/or are sloppy.
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Mistakes show up more if you play with a pick.The initial attack is unforgiving when hitting a bum note.
I'm hopeless playing finger style, I then sound like a 1st year bassist.
But the real reason I started as and stayed a pick player was audibility. When I started out with a 30 watt Dynachord Echolette Showstar "bass" amp, I could hardly hear myself playing in the band - and only if I played with a pick and in the high registers. It determined my style.
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I heard a band last weekend where the bass player (a fingerer, but that wasn't it) really grated on me. The first time was during JJ Cale's Cocaine (announced as "Eric Clapton's Cocaine", but never mind), where he insisted on playing the mostly two-step bass without any syncopation throughout, which killed the groove. And as they encored with a sloppy "Knockin' On Heaven's Door", he added insult to injury by playing the G to D root notes everytime when changing from the G maj chord to D maj one. Not once did it occur to him to play a revolutionary G and F# to the G/D change, much less perhaps throw in an E with the third chords C maj/A minor (depending on the part of the song). I thought if Sir Paul McCartney would have died that moment, he would have lived (and played) in vain. :-\
The guy was older than me, you would have expected that the concept of a third had crossed his musical paths sometime in the past, if fleetingly. Miraculously, they also hailed themselves as a Southern Rock band (they strangled a few Allman Brothers songs as well), a form of music relying more on thirds and harmony than many others.
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You don't run across Southern rock bands in the South all that much anymore. Often when I see one on the Internet, it's one in a foreign country. Needless to say, this particular band doesn't seem like it is very spectacular. I would be glad to miss that one.
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When I started to play bass, I played fingerstyle only.
I had taken guitar lessons from a flamenco teacher and he taught me to use all fingers on my right hand (except for the pinky. don't know why). Hours and hours of training, alternating between the fingers (PAMI, PIAM, PMIA, etc).
It came in handy when I started to play bass in band that did Iron Maiden covers et cetera. Steve Harris was my idol back then ;-)
It wasn't after ten years in a band that I learned to play with a pick. I had started a tribute band doing Thin Lizzy songs. And Phil Lynott had this very steady pulsating right hand pick technique. Again hours and hours of practice to get that down pat.
I'm glad I learned both, because it just extends the palette of choice.
Never been much of a slapper though :mrgreen:
I used to alternate between pick and no pick depending on the song but these days I play all finger style because we play mostly oldies. A long time ago, probably 1967 I saw a Chicago area band The Flock. The bassist played a Fireglo Rickenbacker bass and used all the fingers on his right hand. I was impressed but rarely use more than two.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W2AxRoeCJKo
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The Flock were great. Jerry Goodman on violin.
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Trust our resident proggie to even know the most arcane progenitors of the trade! Without missing a strange meter. :mrgreen:
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;D Hey, he's a local as well! I was a fan of his solo stuff on the Private Music label back in the 80s, and was at the taping of his live album during that time at a great venue in Chicago called Park West. He's also played on a couple of my friend and occasional band mate Dave Uhrich's albums. And of course the fiddle player in my band knows him (because all rock string players know each other ;) )
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zFROaBpXaXs
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Me too. I'm still faster and more accurate with fingers than a pick.
I am faster and more accurate with fingers but I keep trying to work with a pick as needed or when I think about it which is not really often