The Last Bass Outpost
Gear Discussion Forums => Bass Amps & Effects => Topic started by: rahock on August 03, 2011, 02:19:04 PM
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I took a 45 mile ride to the closest place that handles GB stuff and tried out the Shuttle 6.0 through the 2 10 cab. t This is an 8 ohm cab, so I was only getting 375 watts but it sounded good. It has all the features I like , bass boost /treble boost/mid scoop and it is a nice clean sound with the ability to add a little dirty push from the tube preamp. It is not as bottomy as my Seymour Duncan head but I was playing through 10 inch speakers rather than the 12s that I'm used to. I liked it ;D. I think I might be pulling the trigger on this thing and I may spring for the foot switch too.
Thanks to everyone and particularly Pilgrim for all the good input on this thing.
Rick
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Thanks for the note - glad it sounded good to you. All in all a pretty remarkable piece of engineering.
I found a foot switch at Talkbass for a good price, so I added it. Interesting - if you mute with the foot switch, the manual mute button is bypassed - you also have to un-mute with the foot switch. Not a problem as far as I'm concerned.
I haven't played through them, but the word seems to be that the Genz uber-bass cabinets are killers...although they're not as light as the Shuttle series.
The 12" cabs all seem like good choices to me; for more bottom, a double-12 would be better than a single.
Contradicting my last statement, I went with a 2x10 Shuttle series cab that I add to the docking 12 and get 4 ohms. It pleases my ears...and it was at a great price, slightly used at my local store. I decided not to wait for a 2x12.
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How much does a Shuttle 6.0 go for?
I tried a Shuttle 9.0 a few weeks ago and it was phenomenal.
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The 6.0 is $679 at Musicians Friend. I really would have preffered to buy it from the store I was at, but their price was $820 and they didn't seem all that negotiable, so I went online. The cabinet I'll be using is a 2 12 and tweeter Avatar with Eminence speakers. It's a 500 watt cab but I think it will work just fine.
Rick
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Pretty good combination. I used to play this rig at a larger and louder church than the one I presently attend:
(http://i1101.photobucket.com/albums/g421/spiritbass/p1110250up6.jpg)
I thought of it as the "Shavatar". I pulled the tweet and mounted a mid-driver instead. Loud & clear!
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How much does a Shuttle 6.0 go for?
I tried a Shuttle 9.0 a few weeks ago and it was phenomenal.
There are many who like the Shuttle 9.0 even more than the 6.0. There are some long discussions about the 9.0 on TB. Its peak power ratings are higher, and its voicing is somewhat different - all discussed in those threads.
This is a good thread, where in post #17 Agedhorse (a Genz engineer) discusses differences in the Shuttle series models and the Shuttlemax series. http://www.talkbass.com/forum/f15/genz-benz-shuttle-9-0-discussion-thread-594562/
It's a long thread, but Agedhorse was active in it and provided a lot of great info.
For my use, the Shuttle 6.0 has at least 50% more power than I ever expect to need, and I like the sound through the Shuttle cabs, so all is well. I have wondered what it would sound like through a Neo 15 or Neo 2x12, but not enough to spend money on the experiment.
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Pretty good combination. I used to play this rig at a larger and louder church than the one I presently attend:
(http://i1101.photobucket.com/albums/g421/spiritbass/p1110250up6.jpg)
I thought of it as the "Shavatar". I pulled the tweet and mounted a mid-driver instead. Loud & clear!
What mid driver are you using? That sounds like a good plan ;D.
Rick
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18sound 6.5". I attached a small plastic trash can (Wal-mart special) to the back of the baffle to cover the driver and isolate it from the rest of the enclosure. I sold the horn & crossover to another tinkerer then bought a nice inductor & cap to high-pass @ 800hz IIRC, leaving the woofers running full-range. I also installed a 100W L-pad, but I usually left it full-on. If I was still playing out, I'd be running through Avatar(s)...
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The 6.0 is $679 at Musicians Friend. I really would have preffered to buy it from the store I was at, but their price was $820 and they didn't seem all that negotiable, so I went online. The cabinet I'll be using is a 2 12 and tweeter Avatar with Eminence speakers. It's a 500 watt cab but I think it will work just fine.
Rick
I have the same cab and it sounds great with anything i have put on top of it from ampeg hybrids to hartke and most recently an Eden. usually turn of the horn. but tell me more about the midrange changeover....
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My tweeter stays at about 1/4 volume or less. I normally keep the treble pretty low on the instrument and when I do turn
the treble on the instrument up that tweeter comes on pretty strong. It took me a while to learn to use/appreciate a cab with a tweeter. This midrange mod really intrests me though. It makes more sense and sounds more durable than a tweeter to me. I am afraid of that volume control on the tweeter, I know how easy they can blow.
Rick
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The 18sound mid-driver was their 6ND410: http://www.usspeaker.com/eighteensound%20index-1.htm Pricey, but worth it in my book. I don't remember the values of the capacitor and inductor, but I sourced them through Parts Express. I used an on-line crossover calculator to arrive at the values. I mounted them on the brace that goes from the baffle and back panel of the cab. The trash can utilized for isolation was molded from rigid plastic. With the woofers removed, I was able to hold it in place as reached through the hole for the mid-driver and apply silicone to hold it in place. The small hole for passing the hookup wires for the mid-driver was also sealed with silicone. It's been a few years since I did this mod and that's about all I remember. I hope this helped. Even easier method of figuring out values for high-pass (butterworth) filter components: pick a more knowledgeable brain than mine! If you don't want to do that, Parts Express carries Eminence crossovers. I'm not affiliated, but they are a good one-stop shop for projects like this. I can't testify to how it sounds, but Eminence offers a closed-back mid-driver that would not need an enclosure to isolate it. I hope this helped...
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thanks for the info. you ran the woofers full and then added the mid in a capacitor no ohm load setup correct... that's what got my interest up. always hate what 2 or 3 way cabs do to the woofers mids and high. full pass thru and then how much i want to ad if any sounds like the perfect cabinet to me.
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You're very welcome. More food for thought: I haven't experience it with my ears, but others have used the Eminence LA6-CBMR sealed back mid-driver (would not require isolation) to good effect. It is also about half the price ($60) of the 18sound driver. Here is a link to a TB thread where someone used them in a couple of Avatar SB112's: http://www.talkbass.com/forum/f15/adding-6-mid-range-driver-cab-770145/index3.html I agree with Bill Fitzmaurice as to why more manufacturers don't use a mid driver instead of a tweeter - tweeters are less expensive.
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BTW- to return to the original topic...search the classifieds on Talkbass and you often can find nice used Shuttles.
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Well, I got my new Shuttle and got to play with it last night. I've graduated from saying it sounds good to saying it sounds great and I love this thing ;D.
When you're playing with a couple guitars, drums and a harmonica, you really get to hear the outstanding note definition that this thing has. My Seymour Duncan head is no slouch but the Shuttle is a very unique piece of modern engineering. The boost features are not as strong as the Duncan and at first I viewed this as a negative, but after playing it for a while and working with a full band I realized that the Duncan was a bit too strong and that the more subtle approach of the Shuttle actually works much better. Less overbearing and more natural. The boys in the band love it as much as I do. It is very strong, the preamp tube brings a nice bit of warmth without making it slurry and fuzzy, and again, the note definition is unlike anything I have ever used. Every note cuts through without burying the other instruments. It cuts through, yet blends well. Tough to explain, but you get it when you hear it. It makes that Avatar 2 12 and tweeter cab sound like an absolute gem. I'm a happy guy ;D
Rick
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BTW- to return to the original topic...search the classifieds on Talkbass and you often can find nice used Shuttles.
That's exactly how I got mine.
So far it's my favorite amp I've owned hands down.
(if I recall correctly that list would consist of: early-80s roland cube 60, 80s peavey TNT-130, Randall RB140 or something, GK 200RB, Eden WT500, Eden WT300, Thunderfunk 400, AI Clarus, AI Focus II, AI Focus III, Genz-Benz Shuttle 6.0.)
Not only is it ridiculously loud for something so small (way way louder than the AI Focus III I used to have), the preamp is very easy to use and sounds good with very little tweaking.
The overdrive from pushing the gain hard isn't bad either, works for me anyway.
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That's exactly how I got mine.
So far it's my favorite amp I've owned hands down.
(if I recall correctly that list would consist of: early-80s roland cube 60, 80s peavey TNT-130, Randall RB140 or something, GK 200RB, Eden WT500, Eden WT300, Thunderfunk 400, AI Clarus, AI Focus II, AI Focus III, Genz-Benz Shuttle 6.0.)
Not only is it ridiculously loud for something so small (way way louder than the AI Focus III I used to have), the preamp is very easy to use and sounds good with very little tweaking.
The overdrive from pushing the gain hard isn't bad either, works for me anyway.
I agree on all counts! I have never been able to understand why some people think it lacks power. To me it's VERY loud. I also find that the slight OD from the tube preamp sounds very warm and pleasing.
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I agree on all counts! I have never been able to understand why some people think it lacks power. To me it's VERY loud. I also find that the slight OD from the tube preamp sounds very warm and pleasing.
When you turn the volume up it stays incredibly clean and defined, unless you crank the preamp and gain. I think that this deceives a lot of people who associate that lack of clean with loud. Even when you do crank the preamp , it just warms it and gives it a pushy sound, not full blown overdriven distortion that is bordering on a fuzztone. If full blown overdrive is what you're looking for this is not the amp you want.
Rick
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If full blown overdrive is what you're looking for this is not the amp you want.
Rick
Problem solved...I have the Scott Humphreys bass mod version...
(http://i83.photobucket.com/albums/j306/apowell1/Electric%20Basses/PC270228-1.jpg)
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Problem solved...I have the Scott Humphreys bass mod version...
(http://i83.photobucket.com/albums/j306/apowell1/Electric%20Basses/PC270228-1.jpg)
I didn't mean I thought it was a problem , I like it just the way it is ;D. That one little tube gives it all the gain and push I want. On a lot of solid states the gain or overdrive control is pretty close to a fuzztone, on the Shuttle it is not, and that is just right for my taste. As I mentioned earlier,even the boost controls are toned down a bit from what many amps do for boost. At first I saw this as a negative, but it actually works much better being a bit more subtle. When I hit the bass boost or the treble boost on my Seymour Duncan amp, I have to back the volume down a bit on the instrument or I will bury the rest of the band, not to mention vibrating unattended glasses off the bar. When hitting a boost switch on the Shuttle, it gives you just enough to stand out for a solo or to exagerate a line. It's not like pulling the pin on a grenade. The Shuttle head brings so much clarity and volume to my Avatar cabinet, it's like I bought new speakers too. No complaints from me...........only praise ;D
Rick
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Cool, it just gave me the chance to share a photo.
I only use that box on one or two numbers a night - things like Jack the Ripper.
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It's no fuzztone, true, but on anything other than my low-output Danelectro (90's model DC2), there is way more gain and grit available than I need. Lately I favor my Gibson LPB1 and set the gain around 1:00 or maybe 2:00.
When I need more, like Pilgrim I have a secret weapon:
(http://www.robertkeeley.com/images/products/14.jpg)
... the Keeley-modded version, that is. Most transparent overdrive I've found so far.
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I've dealt with and worked for quite a few manufacturers through the years and have NEVER found a Company as easy to get along with as Genz-Benz. When I had a Genz Go down on me, I called and had a NEW amp on my doorstep the next morning. The part of that deal which impressed me the most is that they wanted the bad amp BACK.....to take it apart and see what caused the problem. Then they followed up to make sure I was fine with the replacement. IMHO....the Finest Manufacturer I've ever had the Pleasure of Playing With.....bar none. "Gotta' Getta' Genz!"
I Believe it may have been Pilgrim who commented on their 12" cabs. Outstanding........Truly.
Bass-ically Yours,
RB
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I played a Genz combo once (I think it was a 2x12, but it might have been a 2x10) and its sound was incredibly pushy, even penetrating, I've never heard myself so well on a stage even with much larger rigs. It was a "make way for me!"-sound, clean and mighty, but not sterile. Played it with my Epi Explorer with TB Plus pups and that bass with that rig commanded air superiority over all other instruments all night.
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I played a Genz combo once (I think it was a 2x12, but it might have been a 2x10) and its sound was incredibly pushy, even penetrating, I've never heard myself so well on a stage even with much larger rigs. It was a "make way for me!"-sound, clean and mighty, but not sterile. Played it with my Epi Explorer with TB Plus pups and that bass commanded air superiority over all other instruments all night.
Since I bought this amp I find myself using the word "Definition" much more than I ever did before. If there is a better word I need to find it because I'm beating the hell out of "Definition" ;D
Rick