60s Hagstrom Bass Necks

[mc2NY]

Okay....since I just learned about old Ric Bass truss rods that I had no idea about in another post.

Here is another related question.

I played old Hagstrom 8-string basses back in the early 80s....full time for a few years, as hard as that might be to comprehend

I eventualy ended up with FIVE of them...two full-time on stage, one back-up and two for parts, as things broke on the main ones.
I tended to snap the tiny saddles at the point where the setscrew help them on the bridge...and also wore out tuners.

Anyway.....one day I stopped in mu local music store to have an electrical problem repaired on one. While the tech had it, I said to throw a new set of strings on it. He said come back to pick it up tomorrow....

When I showed up and took it out of the case to try out, the string action was like a half inch off the fretboard up at the body end. I flipped out and asked "WTF did you do to my bass?"  The store owner acted like it was a big surprise. He ended up telling me to leave the bass and his tech would look at it.

When I returned a couple days later, I was told they tried to adjust the truss rod with no luck. Then they tried to heat press the neck, again with no luck. They said it was a mystery and there was nothing they could do to repair it.

That bass was my main player or a few years. Custom trans blackburst finish..Billy Sheehan liked it so much he had the same shop make him a dupe!  I still have it, for sentimental reasons but it unplayable. Before this incident, they action was the lowest of any bass I had owned. Played incredible.  At one point I had put all new truss od nuts in all my Hag basses in the 80s. They were some mini metric slothead screws. I hunted down the correct size replacements but with hex heads because the slotheads tended to crack/strip. Those worked great for years,

Anyone ever have a similar problem with old Hagstrom Basses? I cannot imagine that huge aluminum T rod theyused int eh necks going bad, so the bass never got repaired. Sure would be great to finally make it playable again, just to pay it back for all the use I got out of it.

[drbassman]

Not many of us had Hag basses back in the day!

[chromium]

Take this with a grain of salt because I've never actually touched one of these....  but for a while I was really interested in the early guitar synth systems like the Hag Patch 2000.  Never ended up landing one, but in looking at them (they were based on the Swede model) it appeared they employed a unique type of rail in place of a typical truss rod.  This provides the relief adjustment, and also supposedly helps keep the neck from twisting.  I think other Hagstroms used this setup too.

Inside that big rail that runs thru the neck, there's a rod that had to be flexed into the right curvature to set the relief properly.  The truss rod nut (not like the typical nut, it's more of a set-screw) holds that rod and its curvature in place.  Similar to the early Rics- it may not influence movement of the neck on its own.  Rather, you might have to loosen the string tension, loosen that truss rod set-screw, and manually bend the neck in a backbow.. applying pressure to the neck at the midway point to get that rod oriented into the correct curvature.  If that makes any sense.

It could be that your bass is fine, and that rod is just curved in the wrong direction.  Might have just flipped around in there and thrown the tech for a loop.  

Being that it has sat for a while like that, you may have to coax it a bit (e.g. clamp the neck into a backbow for a while...)

Anyway, just some thoughts and possible things to investigate...

I've only ever played on one Hag bass - guitarist in my last band had it most of his life.  It's a H2B.  Looks a little cheesy at first glance, but man- the build was solid as a rock (structurally) and it was a nice player.

[Highlander]

You go months without seeing anything, then two Hag threads come along at once...

(sorry gents... UK bus related humour, re never seeing one at all)

[rahock]

I had a hag 8 string from 1970 till about 9 years ago and it was a beauty. The neck was always perfect. Slim and trim, you could keep the action real low with no trace of fret rattle, intonation up and down the neck was always perfect. That thing was a marvel to me. I only knew a couple of other hag owners with 4 stringers and they were always perfect too. The only problem I ever encountered was with the switches. A tiny bit of dust tended to make them crackle and/or malfunction. Other than that, perfect. I'm definitely no expert on Hagstroms, but the few people I know who have owned them all raved about the perfect and indestructible necks. Sorry I am of absolutely no help to you, but yours is the first problem I have ever heard of with a Hagstom neck .
Rick

[amptech]

Hi!

Got a mail from one of my amp customers, he is bringing in a 60's Hagstrom for a check.
Never crossed paths with an old Hag, will chip into this thread if there is something to say about the neck.
They look good, though.

[Pilgrim]

I have one of the new Hagstrom HB-4 basses.  I think it sounds a little two metallic for me, so I'm selling - but it's a really pretty bass with solid hardware and a nice design. The pickup selector switch has about six positions for a pretty surprising variety of settings.



The old Hags had some really interesting jukebox/space-age trimmings that I really like.

[Highlander]

Randy Meisner used one with the Eagles in the 70's...

[Dave W]

Even Elvis used a Hagstrom -- once.

None of this answers Jon's original question, though.

[mc2NY]

Chromium's idea up top might be worth checking out...that Hag might use some oddball truss setup like early Ric basses.

I have never heard of another Hag 8-string bass with a bum truss rod. They have that fairly massive (compared to the relatively small neck) aluminum T beam running thru the neck, so it seems rather unlikely for it to go bad. So, perhaps it is some wacky system inside of it.

I'll have to get adventurous and try to remove the truss set screw adjuster and try flexing the neck and see if anything comes out.

I wasn't so comfortable at working on my own necks back when this one went bad decades ago. Part of why it ended up sitting in the case so long, forgotten.

Back then, I was the only bassist in the NYC area who actively played Hagstrom 8-strings. Our band was getting lots of press and there were live shots published of me playing it. A few area guitar dealers called me and even showed up at gigs with Hag 8-strings for me to buy because they were oddball basses and hard to sell. I got all of mine for like $150 to $300...hahaha.

My drummer absolutely hated my using them. Always bitched that they lacked bottom end, which is why I eventually ended up with Hamers, Kramers, Veilette-Cintrons and Pedulla 8-strings in the 80s. Outside of Tom Petersson, I cannot think of anyone else who has owned as many 8- and 12-string basses.

When the internet finally started to reveal what gear name guys used, I found it interesting that my ears had sort of led me into the same setups before I ever knew what guys like Entwistle and Petersson used.
Same with my amp rigs...was using vintage SUNN tube amps for 20 years before I realized Entwistle had.
My basic setup had become overdriving my 8-strings with an MXR Micro Amp pedal and running it into the original MXR rack DDL to fatten it up by doubling/chorusing it. That let me define the original 8-string signal better than using an actual 12-string bass but still allowed me to mix in a similar fattening chorus.

I remember when Mark Eagan first started to get press for using an 8-string and effects? He was doing a clinic in New Jersey, so I went and dragged my drummer. After sitting thru the whole thing, my drummer looked at me and said...."you've been doing the same thing for the last two years. What's so amazing?" Funny.

[chromium]

I did a quick search but can't find any solid info about setting up the Hags.  I remember having a hard time when I was looking into this stuff before... guess the necks are generally pretty stable if nobody knows how to set them up!  I did find the usual marketing info - that rod is called the "H-Expander Stretcher"



There was one post on Harmony Central that describes what I recall reading, but no idea if its accurate... (see second post from bottom)
http://www.harmonycentral.com/t5/Electric-Guitars/Hagstrom-H-Expander-Truss-Rod/td-p/19658530

Something I might try... call up one of the big shops like Gruhn's who has probably encountered these, and see if you can get any info out of them.  Or maybe a guitar forum might pan out better - assuming there are a greater number of Hag 6-stringers around...

My basic setup had become overdriving my 8-strings with an MXR Micro Amp pedal and running it into the original MXR rack DDL to fatten it up by doubling/chorusing it.

I love the way the coursed stringers sound with some OD.  I've been running mine through an EXH English Muff'n, and using one of my Space Echos with the bass rig for a doubling effect like you describe... almost a really light, subtle slapback.

Hope the Hag setup works out, and if you have any pics/audio of it... share 'em up here sometime!

[mc2NY]

Hmmmmmm.....DOES sound a lot like adjusting the early Ric bass truss rods, like my original thought from the Ric thread.

That's good news. Maybe I will luck out and my "bad" Hag neck from the 80s will turn out to be OK.

Stay tuned.....

[Dave W]

Wow. That HC post is really valuable, assuming it's correct. It does make sense, yet I haven't seen it explained anywhere else.

Jon, sounds like there may be hope for yours yet.

[Happy Face]

"Back then, I was the only bassist in the NYC area who actively played Hagstrom 8-strings. Our band was getting lots of press and there were live shots published of me playing it."

mc2NY - what band was that and when? 

[Dave W]

"Back then, I was the only bassist in the NYC area who actively played Hagstrom 8-strings. Our band was getting lots of press and there were live shots published of me playing it."

mc2NY - what band was that and when?

Jon may be talking about The Toys.